Click On Globe To View Forum Visitors From Around The World

About This Forum

This snuff bottle community forum is dedicated to the novice, more experienced, and expert collectors. Topics are intended to cover all aspects and types of bottle collecting. To include trials, tribulations, identifying, researching, and much more.

Photobucket

Among other things, donations help keep the forum free from Google type advertisements, and also make it possible to purchases additional photo hosting MB space.

Forum Bottle in the Spotlight

Charll shared this beautiful Xianfeng (1851-1861) dated bottle depicting NeZha combating the Dragon King amongst a rolling sea of blue and eight mythical sea creatures.

"The Peter Bentley Snuff Bottle Collection"
and "introduction by Bill Patrick"


Chinese Snuff Bottle Discussion Forum 中國鼻煙壺討論論壇
December 01, 2021, 01:14:00 am
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
 
  Home Help Search Contact Login Register  

Grisaille Landscape Porcelain Snuff Bottle

Pages: [1]
  Print  
Author Topic: Grisaille Landscape Porcelain Snuff Bottle  (Read 191 times)
YT
Private Boards
Hero Member
***
Gender: Male
Posts: 1591



« on: October 20, 2021, 04:48:15 am »

Dear all,

Sharing a newly acquired Bottle. Couldn't find similar bottles anywhere. Dating?? Name?  Huh

A Grisaille Landscape Porcelain Snuff Bottle on an Off-White ground.
Decorated with a landscape scene all round and signed off with two characters (止梅 Zi Mei??) and a red seal that resembles the character
治 zhi.
Just a tinge of Blue and peach coloured on the elderly man walking across the bridge as seen on the attached photo.
Base is a museum written 31.148A red mark on the concentric circle.
Height 8.0cm

Provenance:
Emma Harter Sweetser;
Indianapolis Museum of Art, Indiana, accessioned in 1931 no. 31.148;
Christies New York.

Best,
YT


* 717a.jpg (158.45 KB, 1133x659 - viewed 29 times.)

* 717b.jpg (113.79 KB, 852x581 - viewed 24 times.)

* 717c.jpg (97.95 KB, 569x804 - viewed 19 times.)
Report Spam   Logged

Share on Facebook Share on Twitter

Fiveroosters aka clayandbrush
Private Boards
Hero Member
***
Gender: Male
Posts: 3569



« Reply #1 on: October 20, 2021, 09:11:13 am »

Dear YT,
this type of black enamel is typical of late Guangxu - Republic period.
For your reference, here is an eggshell bowl of mine, marked Hongxian (which is not correct, exept the about period).
Kind regards
Giovanni


* IMG_3.jpg (64 KB, 1000x1000 - viewed 12 times.)

* IMG_6.jpg (84.1 KB, 1000x666 - viewed 13 times.)

* IMG_7.jpg (79.1 KB, 1000x666 - viewed 10 times.)

* IMG_9.jpg (31.87 KB, 1000x611 - viewed 9 times.)
Report Spam   Logged

YT
Private Boards
Hero Member
***
Gender: Male
Posts: 1591



« Reply #2 on: October 20, 2021, 09:30:29 am »

Dear Giovanni,

Thank you, the bowl looks similar.

Cheers,
YT
Report Spam   Logged

Joey
Private Boards
Hero Member
***
Gender: Male
Posts: 9874


« Reply #3 on: October 20, 2021, 11:11:21 am »

Dear YT,

  It might be late (late Qing), but it is a beauty.
Congratulations,
Joey
Report Spam   Logged

Joey Silver, collecting snuff bottles since Feb.1970

rpfstoneman
Private Boards
Hero Member
***
Gender: Male
Posts: 2016



« Reply #4 on: October 20, 2021, 11:31:51 am »

YT,

A spiral ring (rather than concentric) base which you do not see very often.  Lovely bottle, and my immediate thought was the last half of the 18th century.  Giovanni would have more experience with grisaille porcelain than I.  It seems that I have seen a similar shaped bottle with this painting style.  I'll keep your bottle in mind and come back to this thread if I can relocate that example or find another.

Charll   
« Last Edit: October 20, 2021, 12:29:16 pm by rpfstoneman » Report Spam   Logged

Charll K Stoneman, Eureka, California USA, Collector Since 1979.

YT
Private Boards
Hero Member
***
Gender: Male
Posts: 1591



« Reply #5 on: October 21, 2021, 03:44:48 am »

Thanks Joey.

Wow!! It took me quite a while looking at the actual base to see the spiraling. Charll, how did you managed with the low res photo?
Thank you.

Best,
YT
Report Spam   Logged

Joey
Private Boards
Hero Member
***
Gender: Male
Posts: 9874


« Reply #6 on: October 21, 2021, 05:05:36 am »

Charll is the guru of concentric rings and spiral rings on the bases of porcelain bottles.
He seems to have a sixth sense.
Joey
Report Spam   Logged

Joey Silver, collecting snuff bottles since Feb.1970

Fiveroosters aka clayandbrush
Private Boards
Hero Member
***
Gender: Male
Posts: 3569



« Reply #7 on: October 21, 2021, 07:02:21 am »

Dear YT, I too noted that but didn't know if it has importance or not.
It is very evident by the snail shape at the center of the base. See on the lower right side of the picture.
Regards,
Giovanni


* indexo.php.jpg (141.45 KB, 852x581 - viewed 15 times.)
Report Spam   Logged

YT
Private Boards
Hero Member
***
Gender: Male
Posts: 1591



« Reply #8 on: October 22, 2021, 03:02:54 am »

Dear Giovanni,

Actually it is important as it depicts the accuracy of the bottle's description.
The more I researched, the rarer the bottle. Especially with the bottle shape's waisted neck and the spiral base.

Didn't know Grisaille-decorated objects even for Republic period can command a good price too.

Cheers,
YT
Report Spam   Logged

Tom B.
Private Boards
Hero Member
***
Gender: Male
Posts: 590



« Reply #9 on: October 22, 2021, 11:53:58 am »

Dear YT,

Very rare IMO and real treasure.  Dating is not easy for rarities, but I definitely think the porcelain is circa 1780-1850. The shape is distinctive with wide mouth and the cylinder tapered at top and bottom.  Add to that the spiral base and I cannot image it was made later than 1850.  The decoration is probably from that time frame but may have added at a later date as Giovanni has suggested.  I went through my image archive and the only thing that comes at all close is side view of a flat oval shaped snuff bottle that is Jiaqing M&P from the Bloch sold by Bonhams Hong Kong in May 2010:

Best regards,

Tom B.

Report Spam   Logged

Best regards,

Tom B.

rpfstoneman
Private Boards
Hero Member
***
Gender: Male
Posts: 2016



« Reply #10 on: October 23, 2021, 12:34:52 pm »


Not to cloud the discussion, but the attached link indicates that the blue and white dragon design bottle has a incised spiral ring base.

Link: https://aggv.ca/emuseum/objects/13607/porcelain-blue-and-white-snuff-bottle-with-dragon-design;jsessionid=DC029FC0E54B6F265868CDC5DAC088DD

All indications are that this bottle is a from the 2nd half of the 19th century.

Charll

Report Spam   Logged

Charll K Stoneman, Eureka, California USA, Collector Since 1979.

Tom B.
Private Boards
Hero Member
***
Gender: Male
Posts: 590



« Reply #11 on: October 23, 2021, 05:22:29 pm »

Dear Charll,

I am glad you are still looking for comparative examples, maybe we will eventually find a good match.  The one in the link isn't really all that close:


* Porcelain Snuff Bottle comparison.jpg (69.02 KB, 446x591 - viewed 6 times.)
Report Spam   Logged

Best regards,

Tom B.

rpfstoneman
Private Boards
Hero Member
***
Gender: Male
Posts: 2016



« Reply #12 on: October 23, 2021, 11:07:59 pm »

Tom B.,

The rarity here is the incised spiral ring base.  I've only seen about 3 over my collective years.  That is the comparison here B&W dragon design bottle, as it might eventually provide some information as to the dating bottles with such a base. 

Charll   
« Last Edit: October 23, 2021, 11:27:14 pm by rpfstoneman » Report Spam   Logged

Charll K Stoneman, Eureka, California USA, Collector Since 1979.

YT
Private Boards
Hero Member
***
Gender: Male
Posts: 1591



« Reply #13 on: October 24, 2021, 04:29:12 am »

Dear Charll and Tom,

Thank you for following up. Appreciate all the information.
Didn't expect to learn so much on an unknown bottle.
At least I can confirm it is a genuine Snuff Bottle and quite rare.

Best Regards,
YT
Report Spam   Logged

Tom B.
Private Boards
Hero Member
***
Gender: Male
Posts: 590



« Reply #14 on: October 24, 2021, 08:48:36 am »

Dear Charll,

I wish there was an image of the base of that B+W because we know that descriptions are not always 100% correct. 

Dear YT,

Your bottle is quite rare on several counts - shape, base, and type of decoration - are all rare if found alone, but you have a trifecta here.  Congratulations again.
Report Spam   Logged

Best regards,

Tom B.

Pages: [1]
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by EzPortal