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February 05, 2023, 08:28:11 pm
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Possible Yue Ware Ram

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George
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« on: May 03, 2020, 12:19:27 pm »

Have not had any luck being the winning bidder on snuff bottles lately, but have stumbled onto a few ceramic and stoneware pieces. The general consensus from a few collectors via social media suggest that this first one is promising for being a correct Yue yao ( Yue ware ). Crossing my fingers they are correct.

A 5" recumbent ram. Yue kiln-sites, late 4th century - early 5th century AD. Western Jin Dynasty (AD 265 - 316) - Eastern Jin Dynasty (AD 317 - 420) - Six Dynasties Period (AD 221 - 589); stoneware covered in a celadon crackled glaze.

From the Yue Kilns in Zhejiang Province located south of Hangzhou Bay, slightly south of present day Shanghai.

Chinese greenware produced in the ancient state of Yue, during the Eastern Zhou dynasty. Yue yao usually refers to Tang dynasty celadon colored stonewares from Zhejiang Province but Yue yao was made here from Eastern Han Dynasty in the the 2nd century, to Song Dynasty Period, at kilns initially concentrated to Shangyu, Yuyao, and Shasoxing in the north of Zhejiang province, the cultural and economic center for the Kuaiji prefecture of the Yue state before the Tang dynasty.

The number of kilns then grew during the Six Dynasties to around thirty. Among the products there are funerary objects connected to the southern rice culture, and storage jars, transported down the Cao'e River and exported by sea via Hangzhou Bay.

High-fired green-glazed ceramics were first made in east China more than 3,000 years ago. The earliest pieces imitated the shapes and decoration of bronze ritual vessels. Later wares were made for daily use and for burial in tombs. Many burial wares were ceramic models that showed aspects of daily life, such as cooking stoves or domestic animals. From about AD 300 onwards, the Yue kilns began producing ink stones and water droppers for calligraphers. In the Tang dynasty (AD 618-906) the wares were used for tea-drinking. They were much admired and praised by poets.

Sent a few pics off to Sotheby's for a look because they have sold a few in the past.
https://tinyurl.com/yatxcbv3


* Yue1.jpg (279.93 KB, 1097x993 - viewed 20 times.)

* yue2.jpg (268.15 KB, 1060x997 - viewed 18 times.)

* yue3.jpg (247.7 KB, 867x1022 - viewed 13 times.)

* yue4.jpg (233.11 KB, 840x1043 - viewed 13 times.)

* yue5.jpg (252.6 KB, 1016x891 - viewed 19 times.)

* yue5a.jpg (233.6 KB, 931x803 - viewed 16 times.)

* yue5b.jpg (474.33 KB, 1348x1051 - viewed 18 times.)
« Last Edit: May 03, 2020, 12:49:12 pm by George » Report Spam   Logged

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Pat - 查尚杰
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« Reply #1 on: May 03, 2020, 07:51:53 pm »

Hi George

This is a cool item!  Not anything I know beans about, but I like the look of it.  This might be something Giovanni can help out with.   Good luck on your hunt and validation...

Stay safe there

 
« Last Edit: May 04, 2020, 06:17:57 am by Pat - 查尚杰 » Report Spam   Logged

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« Reply #2 on: May 03, 2020, 11:49:10 pm »

George,

Another great find! Like Pat, I know absolutely nothing about this type of ware, but it's a lovely looking object.

Are the small holes in the head and tail area meant to work as a dropper? Or were they attachment points for a head adornment and a tail?

Tom
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« Reply #3 on: May 04, 2020, 03:24:30 am »

George,

Another great find! Like Pat, I know absolutely nothing about this type of ware, but it's a lovely looking object.

Are the small holes in the head and tail area meant to work as a dropper? Or were they attachment points for a head adornment and a tail?

Tom

The holes are not for dropper use, but as a means for the kiln heat to vent so a hollow piece like this does not explode, or crack, etc.. ,  is what I understand..

 
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« Reply #4 on: May 04, 2020, 07:10:54 am »

Got it.
Thanks for the education!
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« Reply #5 on: May 04, 2020, 12:03:00 pm »

Dear all,
I have been very busy lately, not having much time for participation. Actually I still am.
Dear George, it is for sure a water dropper. Vent holes are usually made in hided places, like for example inside an ear, or underneath.
I must say that I do not like the glaze. Especially in the picture of the underneath, we can see that it is all spotted. Yue glaze is an hard, compact glaze. This looks artificially stained to me, but I may be wrong.
It will be interesting to hear the opinion of the auction house.
Kind regards
Giovanni
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« Reply #6 on: May 04, 2020, 05:19:09 pm »

Dear all,
I have been very busy lately, not having much time for participation. Actually I still am.
Dear George, it is for sure a water dropper. Vent holes are usually made in hided places, like for example inside an ear, or underneath.
I must say that I do not like the glaze. Especially in the picture of the underneath, we can see that it is all spotted. Yue glaze is an hard, compact glaze. This looks artificially stained to me, but I may be wrong.
It will be interesting to hear the opinion of the auction house.
Kind regards
Giovanni


Thank you Giovanni..  Not sure so about being a water dropper. I have not seen these described as one.   Not very appealing to have the dropper opening on the ass end of an animal.

Legitimate Jin dynasty rams like this are so rare, it seems unlikely from the gate that this one will turn out correct. Of course I will post their response, but it will probably be much the same as you have shared here, and privately with me..

I did just renew my Gotheborg membership. Will share it there after I hear back from the auction house.  If nothing else as a lesson learned ! There are enough members over there that also participate in the couple of Facebook groups I shared this with that seems best to wait until I hear back from the auction house. No sense in beating a dead horse, or in this case, a ram Smiley
« Last Edit: May 04, 2020, 05:49:10 pm by George » Report Spam   Logged

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« Reply #7 on: May 05, 2020, 01:43:37 am »

Dear George,
it is surely meant as a water dropper. You will not find statues, either humans or animals, with so evident vent holes. Note that vent holes are, as said, hided as possible, and placed in different places, while on all these rams the holes are in the same place, the well visible top of the head, which is the logical place for loading it with water.
Also, one single vent hole, regardless how small, is enough for allowing the “breath” of the inner atmosphere.
You can have more than one vent hole on a single statue, but that happens when there are separately potted sections, like the stand, or the head on bigger mingqi statues.
These heads were molded separately from the statue. The reason was that, having various faces with different looking, it was possible to made apparently different statues on the same press molded body.
BTW in the description provided by Sotheby’s, at least for the first and third one, it says that they are meant for the Scholar’s desk.
Talking about objects for the Scholar’s desk, being you a Gotheborg’s member you could see there, in the “Exhibitions and Museum Collections” topic, a thread recently started by myself, titled “Gotheborg's members ensembles - Scholar's desk objects” where I did post five pictures of my collection of such objects. I am sure you will like it.
Kind regards
Giovanni
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« Reply #8 on: May 05, 2020, 02:42:20 am »


BTW in the description provided by Sotheby’s, at least for the first and third one, it says that they are meant for the Scholar’s desk.
Talking about objects for the Scholar’s desk, being you a Gotheborg’s member you could see there, in the “Exhibitions and Museum Collections” topic, a thread recently started by myself, titled “Gotheborg's members ensembles - Scholar's desk objects” where I did post five pictures of my collection of such objects. I am sure you will like it.
Kind regards
Giovanni


I searched for it, but it is not showing up using the forums search feature.. Can you give me a link to the topic ?
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« Reply #9 on: May 05, 2020, 03:23:22 am »

Here it is, but accessible only to registered members:
http://www.gotheborg.com/discus/read.php?file=/262308/886563.html&lm=1588589415
Giovanni
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« Reply #10 on: May 05, 2020, 04:12:17 am »

Here it is, but accessible only to registered members:
http://www.gotheborg.com/discus/read.php?file=/262308/886563.html&lm=1588589415
Giovanni


Just renewed my membership.. Heading over to check it out !
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