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Charll shared this beautiful Xianfeng (1851-1861) dated bottle depicting NeZha combating the Dragon King amongst a rolling sea of blue and eight mythical sea creatures.

"The Peter Bentley Snuff Bottle Collection"
and "introduction by Bill Patrick"


Chinese Snuff Bottle Discussion Forum 中國鼻煙壺討論論壇
December 01, 2021, 01:15:39 am
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Dragon Pillar Snuff Bottles

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Author Topic: Dragon Pillar Snuff Bottles  (Read 5150 times)
Fiveroosters aka clayandbrush
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« Reply #100 on: May 18, 2015, 01:36:17 am »

Dear Charll,
simply "The best"!
Giovanni
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« Reply #101 on: May 18, 2015, 01:43:09 am »

Very nice one indeed Charll.  Congrats!
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Best Regards

Pat
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« Reply #102 on: May 18, 2015, 01:49:08 am »

Another magnificent dragon !!!

Very nice and thanks for sharing....

Pin
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五花馬,千金裘。呼兒將出換美酒,與爾同銷萬古愁。

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« Reply #103 on: May 18, 2015, 03:00:28 am »

Exquisite bottle, Charll.

Would I be right in thinking that most of this type of bottle are soft paste rather than hard paste?

Tom
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« Reply #104 on: May 18, 2015, 03:24:07 am »

Charll,

Thanks for sharing the bottle. Beautiful indeed.

Inn Bok
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« Reply #105 on: May 18, 2015, 09:08:47 am »

Quote
Would I be right in thinking that most of this type of bottle are soft paste rather than hard paste?

Tom,

These concentric ring bottles seems to have balanced mix in production of both soft and hard paste forms from what I've observed.   A few years ago I would have said most were hard paste, but recent observations indicate there are a lot of soft paste bottles in circulation. 

Charll
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« Reply #106 on: May 18, 2015, 12:19:53 pm »

Dear Charll,
it would be very interesting to know why soft paste is so common in the snuff bottles field and so rarely seen on bigger porcelain ware. There must be a reason for that.
Kind regards
Giovanni
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« Reply #107 on: May 18, 2015, 04:53:53 pm »

Dear Giovanni,

     Dr. Stephen Little suggested to me that the reason snuff bottles and other small objects were often done in soft paste, was because it was easier for scholars to find small scale artisans to make the pieces in soft paste, and to have more of an input. I've seen small covered boxes, water droppers, and many other small wares in soft paste.

     It did not need kilns as hot as those producing hard paste wares, and could be produced in Beijing, etc., rather than just in Jingdezhen.
     Best,
Joey
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« Reply #108 on: January 14, 2021, 10:50:43 pm »

All,
This dragon pillar snuff bottle was recently offered on eBay, which to me is a remarkably high quality bottle that I would place in a top tier of this group.  A highly detailed, crisp, dragon design that employs use of multiple cobalt blue tonal density that yields high contrast in the painted image against the pure white glazed of the bottle. 

When I saw it, it had a notable familiarity to me.  As it turns out it is a striking match to a bottle in my collection at the bottom of the previous page on this thread.  In comparison of the two bottles, the only divergence in design is in the orientation of the dragon’s manes.  All other design aspects are remarkable similar in style, form, orientation, and placement as if one bottle is a copy of the other, which leads me to believe that the bottles were painted by the same artist.  Maybe part of an Imperial set.

Each bottle is the same height and same diameter, with the only other difference being is that one bottle has 11 concentric rings while the other has 12 rings.   

As stated by Hugh Moss, “apart from being one of the most imposing of all groups of underglaze-decorated bottles, they are also quite obviously imperial (five-clawed dragons are standard in the group).   They remain, as a group, one of the most striking of imperial blue-and-white porcelain snuff bottles, and as an imperial group despite a usual lack of reign-marks, obviously still rank as important.”
If studying comparative bottles is “your thing” take a look at these two bottles.  Once I did, I came to appreciate them even more as a group, and the “wonders it would be like to view them together as an Imperial set of multiple bottles”.

Previous page link: https://snuffbottle.smfforfree.com/index.php/topic,1861.msg35425.html#msg35425

Blue and White Porcelain Dragon Pillar Bottle:
A hard paste porcelain blue and white dragon pillar snuff bottle, of cylindrical form, with a broad flared neck.  Well painted five clawed, camel nosed, scaly dragon chasing a simplified flaming pearl.  Wonderful use of light and dark blue tones that provides contrasting characterization to the dragon image.  Unadorned neck and base that facilitates focal attention to the dragon design solely.  Bottle has a flat unglazed eleven concentric ring base.  Coil ring construction with glazed interior.  Came with a bronze mounted orange-pink coral bead stopper and a stained orange ivory spoon that fits the bottle very nicely.  Height is 3.375 inches (8.7 cm) without stopper by 1.125 (2.8 cm) in diameter. 

Period: Imperial kilns, Jingdezhen, ca. 1820-1860.

Condition: Exceptionally fine estate-fresh condition with no chips, cracks, or repairs.  UV light reveals no hidden damage. 

Provenance: Bottle came from a Canadian estate of Dr Leslie Gifford Kilborn.  Leslie Gifford Kilborn: (1895–1972) son of Omar & Retta Kilborn born in Sichuan, China.  Omar & Retta are considered some of the first and most important Missionary Doctors with the family residing in China for several decades from the year 1891-1960.  The school and hospital the Kilborn family first created is still in operation today.  The Kilborn’s greatly advanced the teaching of western medicine in China.  Leslie was also the author of multiple texts, translator of many textbooks, and served as director of the College of Medicine of West China Union University and dean of the Faculty of the College of Medicine between 1925-1952.  Kilborn also taught at the University of Hong Kong between 1952-60.

Leslie Kilborn and family returned to North America in the earlier 1960s bringing a vast amount of family estate heirlooms collected by the family in China between the years 1880-1960, many of which were gifts from high officials and dignitaries.

Hope you enjoy the comparative analysis as I did,  Charll




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« Last Edit: January 15, 2021, 11:16:49 am by rpfstoneman » Report Spam   Logged

Charll K Stoneman, Eureka, California USA, Collector Since 1979.

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« Reply #109 on: January 15, 2021, 12:44:05 am »

Charll,

An intriguing 'match'. I didn't quite understand if the descriptive text is for your previously posted bottle or for the eBay one, which I assume from your wording that you did not acquire. Excuse me if I misunderstood.

There was once an article in JICSBS by HM devoted to this type of bottle. I was sure one of them was identical to a bottle I had purchased from him a few years before the article was published. I had to go over the illustrations with a magnifying glass to ascertain that none of them were actually mine. Many are remarkably similar.

Tom
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« Reply #110 on: January 15, 2021, 11:12:56 am »


Tom,

The descriptions are different and respective to each bottle.  The previous posted bottle that is in my collection was purchase from a dealer in 2015.  The latter bottle was recently posted on eBay by a Canadian dealer that handles a number of estate sales annually (i.e., same dealer and estate source as the confronting dragons jade bottle I posted recently). 

I was the under bidder on the bottle above  Undecided, but put time in on researching the bottle prior to my bid attempt.  Fortunately,  Cheesy the above bottle came my way as a "second chance" offer by the seller.  I'm just now documenting the comparison process as a reference for both bottles that are now in my collection.

Charll   
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« Reply #111 on: January 16, 2021, 10:05:37 am »


Fortunately,  Cheesy the above bottle came my way as a "second chance" offer by the seller.  I'm just now documenting the comparison process as a reference for both bottles that are now in my collection.
  

Congrats on the acquisition...!

Tom
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« Reply #112 on: January 16, 2021, 04:15:26 pm »

Congratulations Charll !

The detailing is really amazing !

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« Reply #113 on: January 16, 2021, 08:37:48 pm »


Tom,

The descriptions are different and respective to each bottle.  The previous posted bottle that is in my collection was purchase from a dealer in 2015.  The latter bottle was recently posted on eBay by a Canadian dealer that handles a number of estate sales annually (i.e., same dealer and estate source as the confronting dragons jade bottle I posted recently). 

I was the under bidder on the bottle above  Undecided, but put time in on researching the bottle prior to my bid attempt.  Fortunately,  Cheesy the above bottle came my way as a "second chance" offer by the seller.  I'm just now documenting the comparison process as a reference for both bottles that are now in my collection.

Charll   

Dear Charll,

That seems like a hard earned and well deserved find. It will be a waste if you didn't get the bottle with the amount of research you did.
Wow! Congrats.

As for the top bidder, he sounds like a shill bidder?

Cheers,
YT
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« Reply #114 on: February 12, 2021, 04:49:28 pm »

Dear Charll,

     The bottle looks superb.
But is there any wear to the glazed surface?
It looked pristine to me.
Best,
GUNG HEE FAT CHOY  {Cantonese Pronunciation} / GONG XI FA CAI {Mandarin}
Shabbat Shalom,
Joey
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« Reply #115 on: February 12, 2021, 06:10:07 pm »

Joey,

They must call it hard paste for a reason!   Wink   Under a loop there are massive amounts of fine abrasions that are not easily seen by the naked eye, but give the bottle a silky mat finish appearance.  It is that way on both bottles. 

Charll
« Last Edit: February 12, 2021, 06:48:52 pm by rpfstoneman » Report Spam   Logged

Charll K Stoneman, Eureka, California USA, Collector Since 1979.

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« Reply #116 on: February 12, 2021, 08:21:13 pm »

Gorgeous bottle Charll. So much detail.

Brian
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« Reply #117 on: February 12, 2021, 11:51:33 pm »


The Anatomy of a Dragon

Here are side by side pics of the bottles mentioned in the recent post.  I’m still convinced that they were done by the same hand. 

   

Charll


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* 100_2986.JPG (191.46 KB, 800x800 - viewed 13 times.)

* 100_2987.JPG (189.83 KB, 800x800 - viewed 14 times.)
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« Reply #118 on: February 13, 2021, 01:13:25 am »


Here are side by side pics of the bottles mentioned in the recent post.  I’m still convinced that they were done by the same hand. 



Charll,

You may very well be right. The detailed brush strokes look almost identical.

Tom
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« Reply #119 on: February 13, 2021, 03:27:07 pm »

Dear Charll,

    Thanks. Then I've no problem it being the age suggested.
Best,
Joey
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Joey Silver, collecting snuff bottles since Feb.1970

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