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August 23, 2017, 10:18:39 pm
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Tientsin Artists

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Author Topic: Tientsin Artists  (Read 101 times)
George
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« on: August 06, 2017, 02:37:48 am »

This is from the Snuff Bottle Review, Vol 5, No 1, March 1980

Interestingly this and the following article titled One Bottle Studio that follows the below article within this Snuff Bottle Review issue are giving these same Tientsin seal clues to my Zhang Yu bottle.

Peter, I was able to find some, but not all the names below within your db under Tianjin. Unless I am missing it, I do not see those Modern Tianjin artists within the db as being connected to Tientsin or Tientsin mentioned.

The very last picture is from the Snuff Bottle Review, Vol 3, No 3, June 1978 that is mentioned within the article..

Same with the names on that list.. Some I could find within your db , but not all..


* tientsin1.jpg (122.59 KB, 729x201 - viewed 11 times.)

* tientsin2.jpg (322.42 KB, 728x1101 - viewed 12 times.)

* tientsin3.jpg (203.96 KB, 619x965 - viewed 13 times.)

* tientsin4.jpg (284.67 KB, 630x1019 - viewed 18 times.)
« Last Edit: August 06, 2017, 03:00:38 am by George » Report Spam   Logged

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Peter Bentley 彭达理
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« Reply #1 on: August 06, 2017, 06:15:56 am »

Hi  George

INTERESTING   STUFF  !

I need to  delve   deep  into  my  latest  DB  and  do some   reconciling

There  was a brief  period  of time   during the  early  years  of the  CR when the  whole  MIPB  "school"  was   banished  to  Tianjin ( Tientsin)  and  it's well known  that  WXS  painted   several  bottles  there, some  of  which  found their  way to the   West  via the  Guangzhou Trade  Fair,  which   fortuitously  continued  all through the  CR

More  work to do,  and  when  it's  finished  I will  YET  AGAIN   update  my  DB   before  I send  you the promised  copy  for safekeeping

Cheers

Peter
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Peter Bentley 彭达理
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« Reply #2 on: August 08, 2017, 12:09:04 pm »

Hi  George,

Thanks for  the old Snuff Bottle   Review article   (apparently  dated  1978, not 1980) on  early Ji School  artists  while  they were   still  based  in  Tianjin (Tientsin)  before  moving  with  Wang Xisan  and  Zhang  Rucai to  Hengshui.

I did  a  lot of  work  on the   article  in the past  few days  to  work out exactly   who the   artists  are  and if so  whether they  are already  in  my  DB

It  turns  out that  they  are  indeed  all my  DB,  but  that there  are  a  lot of mistakes  in the  pinyin  in the   article,  so it's  hard to  work  out  who is  who.

I finally  got it  sorted  out   so I  now attach :

a)   The  main  3  pages  of the   article  with hand-written  corrections
b)   A  word-doc with  notes  and   further  explanations about names

It  turns  out   that  all the   artists  listed in the   1978  article  are  referenced  elsewhere. 

Some  are  very well-known e.g.  Wang  Baichuan,  Wang Guanyu,   Suo  Zhenhai,  Dong Kun,  Liu  Ziyi (who is  not to be  confused   with his  son: Liu Yizi !), Chen  Runpu   etc

Others  are  more obscure  and   only  get a  passing  mention   in  J.H. Leung's  "New Look"

And a few  others  are totally  obscure  and  are  only referenced   in  the hand-written  "1981  List" that  someone  posted  on the  Forum  many years  ago which  gives both Wade-Giles and  Pinyin*  names  for a  large  number  of  artists  who were  painting  around  that  time (and  from all the  four  Schools )   - and/or  in the   lists  of  early  WXS  pupil  generations  which can be  found  in  various  places  (my  ICSBS  article - Part 1 is one such  source)

*although  with a  lot  of  errors  in the  pinyin !

I  guess that  the "obscure"  and  "totally obscure"   artists  gave  up  painting  around the time  the  Ji  School moved from  Tianjin  to  Hengshui  when  WXS  and  Zhang Rucai  set  up the  "One  Bottle  Studio"   there  (Yi Hu Zhai)

As   far  as  I recall  from the   sketchy   history of that  time,  the  Ji  School  was  holed up  in  Tianjin  during the   CR   and  bottles only reached  collectors  outside  China  via  a  very few  routes,  one  being the   Canton  Fair.

J.H. Leung  was  also travelling  widely  around  China  at that  time building his   huge  collection (if  ONLY  I had   taken an interest  in  IPBs  and  got to know   J.H. Leung   when I first  came to  HK  to work in 1981...... )

In my  DB  I  have  so far  not   categorized  any  artists  as  specifically  associated   with  the  Tianjin period. 

However,  having  finished the  analysis  of  the 1978  article  I  have  created  a  file  on  the  Tianjin period, which  includes   everything  I have  attached to this  Forum  posting  (and a  lot  more)  and copied  it  into   the  individual   folders  for  each of the   artists  in the  article.  However  I have  not  "coded"  the   artists as  specifically  from that  period.

I  attach the info  and  hope it  downloads  OK and  others   find it  useful

If anyone  sees  any errors   please  do inform  me  -  either  openly  in the  Forum  under this  topic  or  by private  message  if  you  so prefer.

Cheers

Peter

PS:  It's  rather  amusing to  note that  Y.F. "Happy"  Yang was  even confused  by the  names  of   provinces  in  China !

Hebei  河北  meaning   "North  of the (Yellow) River "  is  the  province   wherein both Tianjin and  Hengshui  are located, and   which is  referred to as  "Ji" 冀 for  short   (e.g on car  number plates)  - thus  the  name  of  the  Ji  School.

Hubei 湖北 meaning  "North of the  (Dongting)  lake"  is in  mid-China  and the  capital   city is  Wuhan.  Hubei  has  zero  history  of  IPBs







* CC Tianjin CORRECTED Page 1-3 .jpg (128.9 KB, 675x1024 - viewed 14 times.)

* CC Tianjin CORRECTED Page 2-3 .jpg (73.68 KB, 697x1024 - viewed 14 times.)

* CC Tianjin CORRECTED Page 3-3.jpg (124.51 KB, 766x1024 - viewed 12 times.)
* Tianjin (Tientsin) Notes.docx (23.04 KB - downloaded 4 times.)
« Last Edit: August 08, 2017, 12:24:33 pm by Peter Bentley 彭达理 » Report Spam   Logged

George
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« Reply #3 on: August 08, 2017, 10:05:52 pm »



Hebei  河北  meaning   "North  of the (Yellow) River "  is  the  province   wherein both Tianjin and  Hengshui  are located, and   which is  referred to as  "Ji" 冀 for  short   (e.g on car  number plates)  - thus  the  name  of  the  Ji  School.

Hubei 湖北 meaning  "North of the  (Dongting)  lake"  is in  mid-China  and the  capital   city is  Wuhan.  Hubei  has  zero  history  of  IPBs



I am sure you have probably already shared the above before, but first time I recall reading it... VERY interesting...

Thank you so very much for taking the time to edit the article Peter.. I am making the changes within mine now..

I need to read more and understand better the One Bottle Studio and connected artists and schools ( Hebei,Hubei, and Ji ). I have a hard time wrapping my head around the connections..

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« Reply #4 on: August 09, 2017, 04:09:22 am »

Hi  George

That  geographical  information  about  Hebei  and the  origin  of the  Ji School  name  is all  my  ICSBS  article !

Black marks  for  not  RML&ID  (read, mark, learn  ann  inwardly  digest !)  what  I  wrote

Seems  no-one  has  actually  read  my article  in detail.....   Cry

Cheers

Peter

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Wattana
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« Reply #5 on: August 09, 2017, 05:42:12 am »


Black marks  for  not  RML&ID  (read, mark, learn  ann  inwardly  digest !)  what  I  wrote

Seems  no-one  has  actually  read  my article  in detail..... 


Peter,

That's not quite true. Although I'm not sure about the "inwardly digest" bit....
Some of it is hard to chew !

Tom
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Rube
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« Reply #6 on: August 09, 2017, 07:26:16 am »

Peter,

This is a very helpful translation.  Most of my books on snuff bottles identify the IPSB by their older names, so this is beneficial.  I'm especially grateful to see Suo Zhen Hai as he's kind of on my radar.

Cheers,

Rube.
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