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My yellow jade bottle

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Author Topic: My yellow jade bottle  (Read 281 times)
samsonlzj
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« on: July 24, 2017, 05:58:41 pm »

Dear all,

I bidded with Bonhams for the first time in their recent snuff bottle auction and this is what I bought myself eventually - a yellow jade snuff bottle.

I really adore its plainness and polishing. It feels comfortable in the hand. I also believe it to be imperial of the Palace Workshop although it is not so stated in its catalog description. Simply delighted to have it in my collection.

Dating: 1770-1850
Height: 60mm

Provenance
Y. F. Yang & Co., Hong Kong, acquired 25th November 1984

Enjoy!

Best to all,
Samson









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Rube
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« Reply #1 on: July 24, 2017, 06:50:43 pm »

Samson,
This is a beautiful bottle, and looks like it makes a great companion to your other beauty, congrats!
Cheers,
Rube
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Wattana
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« Reply #2 on: July 24, 2017, 08:44:52 pm »

Dear Samson,

Congratulations on acquiring a wonderful bottle! And with a Y. F. Yang provenance too. As you know, I love plain understated bottles. From the photos alone I would date this bottle mid-to-late-18th century (1750-1800).

All best,
Tom
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Tom
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Joey
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« Reply #3 on: July 24, 2017, 09:04:36 pm »

Dear Samson,

    Yes, I agree that your bottle is Palace Workshops, Qianlong period (ca.1760-1800).
The other one is from a southern California collection (I think Isadore Lample's collection, or possibly Eddie Dwyer's), and was later sold by Clare Chu, Asian Art Studio.
2 beauties.
Best,
Joey
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Joey Silver, collecting snuff bottles since Feb.1970

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« Reply #4 on: July 25, 2017, 03:09:13 am »

Dear Samson,
congratulations for your new purchase.
Was it listed by Bonhams as “yellow jade”? I am asking that because I think that “celadon jade” is more appropriate. Or is it really yellow?
You did not post a picture of the base. Is it flat?
Also, you said nothing about the marvelous white jade bottle of the last two pictures. Did it come in the same lot? Although I too, like Tom, appreciate very much plain bottles, I think that that white jade one is of superior quality.
Kind regards
Giovanni
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samsonlzj
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« Reply #5 on: July 25, 2017, 05:46:44 am »

This is a beautiful bottle, and looks like it makes a great companion to your other beauty, congrats!

Thanks Rube, yes indeed! The white one is in fact my favourite bottle. The chilong carvings subtly emerge under the light. It's a very fine bottle!

Best,
Samson
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samsonlzj
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« Reply #6 on: July 25, 2017, 06:14:43 am »

Dear Tom and Joey,

Thanks for your verifications on the bottle's dating!
 
I compared my bottle with another Palace Workshops example from Bloch Collection: http://www.sothebys.com/en/auctions/ecatalogue/2013/bloch-vii-hk0495/lot.36.html and noticed that the way the mouth of the two bottles look are pretty similar.

Joey, is the bottle sold by Clare cataloged anywhere? I wish to see it too! Roll Eyes

Dear Giovanni,

Thanks! Yes the yellow bottle was listed as yellow jade by Bonhams. Well the tone is rather yellowish, it's yellowness seems to be more vivid under certain levels/directions of light. It does resembles the celadon tone sometimes, depending on the angle from which it is appreciated.

The base may seem flat at a glance but it's not in fact. There's some glue deposit to the foot that can be removed but I don't bother to peel/rub it off to have a better look at the base at the moment. From what I can feel by rubbing my thumb gently on its base, I think it is very slightly concave.

Regarding the white jade bottle, as I mentioned to Rube above, it's my favourite bottle in my entire collection! Actually I've posted it on the forum earlier. You can find it here: http://snuffbottle.smfforfree.com/index.php/topic,3510.0.html

Best to all,
Samson
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Wattana
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« Reply #7 on: July 25, 2017, 06:33:25 am »


I compared my bottle with another Palace Workshops example from Bloch Collection: http://www.sothebys.com/en/auctions/ecatalogue/2013/bloch-vii-hk0495/lot.36.html and noticed that the way the mouth of the two bottles look are pretty similar.


Dear Samson,

A good match! Perhaps from the same 'hand' at the Palace Workshops, and maybe even cut from the same piece of jade.

Tom
« Last Edit: July 25, 2017, 06:35:01 am by Wattana » Report Spam   Logged

Tom
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samsonlzj
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« Reply #8 on: July 25, 2017, 10:56:01 am »

Dear Tom,

Well yes they could be from the same hand who knows... Roll Eyes but I'm astonished by the price Bloch's bottle fetched... My impression is, bottles sold in major auctions in HK tend to fetch higher than usual prices, with the exception of the recent Sotheby's auction... I wonder why is that...

Best,
Samson

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« Reply #9 on: July 25, 2017, 12:45:54 pm »

Dear Samson,
may I ask why you wan't remove the glue on the base? It sounds so strange to me, because I pay more attention to the base than to the mouth, base is so important in judging and dating a bottle. Being jade, there are no risks of damages.
Kind regards
Giovanni
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« Reply #10 on: July 25, 2017, 01:38:38 pm »

Dear Samson,

     I will ask Clare. I just remembered it...
Best,
Joey




Dear Tom and Joey,

Thanks for your verifications on the bottle's dating!
 
I compared my bottle with another Palace Workshops example from Bloch Collection: http://www.sothebys.com/en/auctions/ecatalogue/2013/bloch-vii-hk0495/lot.36.html and noticed that the way the mouth of the two bottles look are pretty similar.

Joey, is the bottle sold by Clare cataloged anywhere? I wish to see it too! Roll Eyes

 
Regarding the white jade bottle, as I mentioned to Rube above, it's my favourite bottle in my entire collection! Actually I've posted it on the forum earlier. You can find it here: http://snuffbottle.smfforfree.com/index.php/topic,3510.0.html

Best to all,
Samson

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samsonlzj
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« Reply #11 on: July 26, 2017, 09:58:24 am »

Dear Joey,

Thanks!

Dear Giovanni,

It may sound strange to you I understand but I have a habit of keeping collectibles I acquired in as they are, in their original state... Roll Eyes I'll try to post a picture of the bottle's base though.

Best,
Samson
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« Reply #12 on: July 26, 2017, 11:15:11 am »

Dear Samson,
 
    I'm sorry, but I don't understand. What do you mean by 'original state'?
The original state as it came from the hands of the craftsman, or the 'original state' it was in when you got it?
Why would that latter case be important?
I acknowledge that in certain cases, I erred in removing collection labels, and not at least documenting them;
but a gunk of glue is not, to me at any rate, sacrosanct.
Best,
Joey
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« Reply #13 on: July 26, 2017, 04:20:38 pm »

Dear Joey,
thank you for letting me know that in English do exist the "sacrosant" word (sacrosanto in Italian) Grin
I am of the same opinion of you. I always clean my pieces and remove what has been added, like varnish etc. Signs of age and dirty are not the same thing.
Kind regards
Giovanni
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« Reply #14 on: July 26, 2017, 06:11:41 pm »

Dear Giovanni,

    Today, I would document and photograph, and try to preserve, labels that were on snuff bottles. This is because the provenance is increasingly important. But I would remove them from the bottle, since they are not original to the bottle.
    But I want the bottle to be clean, as it would have been when coming out of the Palace Workshops, etc. The Qianlong Emperor would NOT have been amused by dirt.
   I wonder if Samson is trying to preserve his feeling when first seeing the bottle.
   
Best,
Joey
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Rube
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« Reply #15 on: July 26, 2017, 06:17:39 pm »

Anyone,
Regarding cleaning bottles, I have a cinnabar bottle that had a stopper glued to the top, and I removed it and repaired the spoon, my first such attempt! Now, I'd like to clean the gooey residue glue from the lip of the bottle. Being lacquer, what should I use?
Cheers,
Rube
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samsonlzj
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« Reply #16 on: July 26, 2017, 07:16:01 pm »

Dear Joey and Giovanni,

Yea, even I don't quite understand myself here. Huh
 Roll Eyes

A gunk of glue is indeed not important or to use your term Joey, not sacrosanct. I just never felt like removing/getting rid of whatever that came with an item, no matter how insignificant it is. This is happening in everything, not just snuff bottles..

It sounds stupid I know... May be I was trying to preserve the feeling when I first saw the bottle? Well, it could be the case perhaps, that seems to be the only reasonable explanation..

Just a strange bit of me, some degree of OCD (obsessive compulsive disorder) perhaps... Roll Eyes

From now, I will learn to overcome my obsession on such insignificant stuff, starting with this gunk of glue on my bottle.

As soon as I finished my breakfast this morning, I retrieved my bottle and rubbed off the glue at its base. Here's a picture of it after I cleaned it, with the base now fully exposed. Smiley

Best,
Samson


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« Reply #17 on: July 26, 2017, 07:28:15 pm »

Dear Sampson,

Congrats! Very nice bottle. I saw it personally in SF.

MC
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« Reply #18 on: July 26, 2017, 08:09:26 pm »

Dear Samson,

     I'd not say 'stupid'; I'd say 'quirky'.  Roll Eyes Grin  And we all have our quirks.
One of mine is to have a clean object, though I DON'T remove patina, which documents the object's age and history.

    But in this case, the beauty of the bottle's indented footrim was definitely worth revealing.
Best,
Joey

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samsonlzj
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« Reply #19 on: July 27, 2017, 07:04:00 am »

Dear Joey,

I too was delighted to see the beauty of the bottle's indented footrim for the first time after I'd removed the glue from it!

You're right, "quirky" is a more suitable word to use in this case! Smiley

By the way, would I risk removing the patina by rubbing the glue off the jade surface?

Best,
Samson

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