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Chinese Snuff Bottle Discussion Forum 中國鼻煙壺討論論壇
July 22, 2018, 03:38:47 pm
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Carved Pixiu - Help Identifying Bone, Tusk, Horn?

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Author Topic: Carved Pixiu - Help Identifying Bone, Tusk, Horn?  (Read 458 times)
cshapiro
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« on: July 13, 2016, 03:49:57 pm »

Hello!
Another little find arrived today from Mobile, Alabama. I know it's silly of me, but because Mobile is close to the ocean I'm thinking this was made from some sort of whale bone, or marine animal bone or tooth of some kind.
I am certain it's not resin. It doesn't have any cross hatching on it, and it has a huge split on one side (I'm sure that detracts from the value but it still has one good side for display!)
So how does one go about determining what this is made of?
Any suggestions would be welcome.
Also it has no top, and I would love to hear ideas on that - I was thinking coral.



* ivory.jpg (483.64 KB, 800x2691 - viewed 55 times.)
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Cathy

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George
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« Reply #1 on: July 13, 2016, 07:16:45 pm »

It is bone of some kind for sure.. Could most likely be something as common as from a cow..

Like the netsuke pepper bottle you shared, look closely at the quality of carving with these cabinet type bottles. Both are "very crudely" carved. No smooth lines, or care in good finish.

I am not sure how to know exactly the type of bone.

I really do not mean to disappoint you in any way when you share your newly acquired treasures..  If you have time before committing to a purchase, feel free to post it prior to taking it home..  We are especially interested in helping a new collector like yourself who is investing in books, and purchasing for their own collection..

You are on the same path as most of us went through starting out..  Difference is, as a group here, there is time to ask for help in identifying what your looking at prior to a purchase.. Those dollars mistakenly spent can add up quickly.. Money that could be spent on books, or even just one single bottle that is special !

Hang in there girl, we got your back if you just take a moment to post a bottle of interest ...  Wink
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Joey
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« Reply #2 on: July 13, 2016, 07:27:02 pm »

Dear Cathy,

     I would vote camel bone, but other than that agree 100% with George.
Don't let yourself get carried away.
 
     Uh, George, I think the Ivory pepper bottle was from Albert.
Best,
Joey
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Joey Silver, collecting snuff bottles since Feb.1970

George
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« Reply #3 on: July 13, 2016, 07:27:53 pm »


 
     Uh, George, I think the Ivory pepper bottle was from Albert.


Ah, sorry about that !
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cshapiro
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« Reply #4 on: July 13, 2016, 07:57:47 pm »

I think we need to start a new thread called "Just for laughs" and I will post all my bottles there

 Cry Cry
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Cathy
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« Reply #5 on: July 13, 2016, 08:56:45 pm »

I think we need to start a new thread called "Just for laughs" and I will post all my bottles there

 Cry Cry

I don't know... It was and still is not all that funny for me when I make a costly mistake..  Wink

It's just all part of the same learning curve that it seem we are all destined to go through before we reap the rewards of good study first..

Your doing just fine, thrilled you are here, and excited to watch as you grow your collection of bottles and reference material !!   

Welcome to the world of collecting !!
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albert
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« Reply #6 on: July 25, 2016, 01:29:25 pm »

Hello,

I think that you have an interesting material made item with a beautiful carved shape; probably this is bone, but in it, is very difficult to see the typical bone holes (may be you can use a magnificent lent), besides the bone of this animal was very big.

I like this unusual snuff bottles!
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« Reply #7 on: July 25, 2016, 07:24:44 pm »

You came to the right place to learn.  This group is very knowledgeable and encouraging.  I have learned so much in the past 4 years.  Hang in there!  I  thank Charll so much for telling me about this group and George for allowing me in!!! Happy Collecting!  Jo in NC
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« Reply #8 on: July 25, 2016, 08:10:57 pm »

Dear Albert,
 
    Don't like it too much - it is best as an example of what NOT to buy! Grin
Guys, before you buy any piece of tat drilled and with a stopper and spoon and called a snuff bottle:
1. think about what a snuff bottle is for
2. and how it was used
3. and does this example (whichever bottle you are looking at) fulfill the needs of a snuff bottle

Snuff bottles are small bottles designed to hold sniffing snuff, a finely ground powdered tobacco, for breathing into the nose, so that
the snuffer can get a nicotine high. 
 
Snuff bottles are almost invariably carried around, so that the owner can take his snuff with him, and share snuff (and the beauty of his bottle) with friends, and need to be relatively easy to slip in and out of their carrying pouch. Which means they need to be pretty streamlined, and thus, if you look at the vast majority of snuff bottles which were made to be used, they ARE streamlined flasks.

This piece, even if it had been from the 'classical period of snuff taking' (ca.1600-1930), which it is not, would be very clumsy to remove from and return to, such a carrying pouch. Therefore NOT a bottle to be desired, AS A SNUFF BOTTLE.
And even as a carving, I'd still not be impressed.
Sorry,
Joey


Hello,

I think that you have an interesting material made item with a beautiful carved shape; probably this is bone, but in it, is very difficult to see the typical bone holes (may be you can use a magnificent lent), besides the bone of this animal was very big.

I like this unusual snuff bottles!

« Last Edit: July 26, 2016, 04:52:20 am by Joey » Report Spam   Logged

Joey Silver, collecting snuff bottles since Feb.1970

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« Reply #9 on: July 25, 2016, 11:21:19 pm »

Good advice from Joey and a reminder for myself.
The Basics of a snuff bottle then looked at the other aspect.

Cheers,
YT
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Fiveroosters
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« Reply #10 on: July 26, 2016, 06:33:44 am »

Dear Joey,
your words of the previous post are pure gold.
It is not only matter of taste indeed (I like it, I don't like it) but also of specific culture. Is that a snuff bottle? NO! It is exactly as you said, a perfect example of what to be avoided under the point of view of snuff bottles collecting. The same must be said, in my opinion, for the previous bottle with an African lion on top of it, seen in another thread (sorry Cathy, but it is for your benefit).
Kind regards
Giovanni
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« Reply #11 on: July 26, 2016, 09:14:34 am »

Dear joey,

Can I understand, that you want to say to me, that itís usually that people catch some items or small bottles, put a stopper, and after they say that this item is a very strange snuff bottle?
And this item is one example of this?
Thanks.

Albert.
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Joey
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« Reply #12 on: July 26, 2016, 10:58:03 am »

Dear Albert,

    And you claim your English is not good!  Shocked
You understood my meaning PERFECTLY.  Grin
I'm sorry Cathy got 'caught' by this truly awful object, but she needs to look more at pictures of top quality
snuff bottles, in the quality books she's bought and received, and train her eye to see why this object is best used for target practice.
Best to all,
Joey
     


Dear joey,

Can I understand, that you want to say to me, that itís usually that people catch some items or small bottles, put a stopper, and after they say that this item is a very strange snuff bottle?
And this item is one example of this?
Thanks.

Albert.

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Joey Silver, collecting snuff bottles since Feb.1970

cshapiro
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« Reply #13 on: July 26, 2016, 11:17:48 am »

Yes, I completely agree with Joey.

Albert I have so many "treasures" that I thought would be very valuable and they have turned out to be novelty items - worthless to anyone except me.

I don't trust myself to buy correctly even though I'm studying and studying about them. So in the meantime, I am quite relying on the member of this forums opinion, and you should too!

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Cathy
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« Reply #14 on: July 26, 2016, 11:20:53 am »

Well, nowadays, if Joey says something, I can't say any....maybe in the future this situation change a bit!
Sorry Joey, Iím improving my English, but is really difficult!

Albert.
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« Reply #15 on: July 26, 2016, 11:22:31 am »

Dear Cathy,

    This is why you need to come to conventions, meet serious dealers, and buy, SLOWLY and CAREFULLY. It makes me sick when I see the stuff you've thrown your good money away on.
Best,
Joey


Yes, I completely agree with Joey.

Albert I have so many "treasures" that I thought would be very valuable and they have turned out to be novelty items - worthless to anyone except me.

I don't trust myself to buy correctly even though I'm studying and studying about them. So in the meantime, I am quite relying on the member of this forums opinion, and you should too!


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Joey Silver, collecting snuff bottles since Feb.1970

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« Reply #16 on: July 26, 2016, 11:26:19 am »

Dear Albert,

    G-D Willing, in 10 or 20 years, you and Cathy will have the level of knowledge Giovanni, Steven, Charll, YT, Tom L., Tom B., Pat, Pin, Peter, Jo, George and I, as well as others, have, and will be able to help others as I hope you will be helped now.
Joey

Well, nowadays, if Joey says something, I can't say any....maybe in the future this situation change a bit!
Sorry Joey, Iím improving my English, but is really difficult!

Albert.
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cshapiro
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« Reply #17 on: July 26, 2016, 11:34:47 am »

Yes Joey, I have stopped buying unless I have a sanction from you or someone on this board.

I got caught up in the excitement of wanting bottles, and haven't ever seen any real bottles (except now in books), and so I made some really bad purchases (many of which are now posted on this forum!).
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« Reply #18 on: July 26, 2016, 11:59:30 am »

Dear Cathy,

     Some of the stuff you posted here and on Collectors Weekly make me want to reprise the 'Friends' on Friends, forcing Rachel to cut up her credit cards!  Cheesy

    But you are buying good books and catalogues. Read, but even more, train your 'eye' to see good and great bottles, and recognise what makes a bottle good, great, or, sadly, FUGLY (Albert,  FUGLY = FU**ING UGLY!  Grin).  And I found in my own experience, that I went from mediocre bottles (in the period 1970 to 1978, I NEVER saw bottles as bad as I've seen the last two weeks from you and from Albert! Honestly.) to great bottles, after I started attending conventions and viewing great collections. It was an amazingly steep learning curve.

But I was blessed to start at age 13 in 1970. And was not spending money without parental approval (I wish I had been; I'd have bought all 10 Corals, and ended up selling 7-8 of them a few years later for a shitload of money, to fund future bottle purchases; and kept the best 2-3 for myself. Or got greedy and kept all 10...  Roll Eyes),
Best to all,
Joey




Yes Joey, I have stopped buying unless I have a sanction from you or someone on this board.

I got caught up in the excitement of wanting bottles, and haven't ever seen any real bottles (except now in books), and so I made some really bad purchases (many of which are now posted on this forum!).
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Joey Silver, collecting snuff bottles since Feb.1970

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