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Green Stone Bottle -Jade?

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Author Topic: Green Stone Bottle -Jade?  (Read 474 times)
cshapiro
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« Reply #20 on: July 09, 2016, 12:30:28 pm »

Ok so I fashioned a string around it to use instead of the paperclip and I submerged it and shook it around a good bit to get all the air bubbles out and got another reading of 14  - putting it at 2.92 specific gravity. So I'm pretty such this is spinach jade - or nephrite.

I read about doing specific gravity tests in Lilla Perry's book, but didn't see the real benefit until now thanks to you guys. I anticipate using this much more in the future!
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Cathy
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« Reply #21 on: July 10, 2016, 08:19:44 am »

Hello Cathy,

The only suggestion I can make is to acquire a 2 decimal point set of pocket scales, these are cheap on ebay. I've tried  with a single point set and they were not accurate enough.

Kind regards,

Paul
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Wattana
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« Reply #22 on: July 10, 2016, 09:47:20 pm »

Cathy,

If the specific gravity range for serpentine is 2.40 to 2.80 and you are consistently getting readings of over 2.90, then I'd agree that it pretty much rules out serpentine.

Of course, if you want to be really punctilious you should send it off to the GIA for a definitive analysis. It could turn out to be a stone we hadn't even considered.  
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Tom
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« Reply #23 on: July 10, 2016, 10:06:19 pm »

Hi Paul and Wattana,

In reading today I came across another type of jadeite called Chloromelanite (also known as Maw sit sit), and it looks just like that. I also read it has a higher specific gravity reading, so I really think this mystery is solved!


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« Reply #24 on: July 10, 2016, 10:11:00 pm »

sorry I misspoke - maw sit sit is another mineral - Chloromelanite is the stone I am referring to!
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« Reply #25 on: July 10, 2016, 10:53:57 pm »

Hi Cathy,

Maw-sit-sit is a type of jadeite specific to a region of Upper Burma (or Myanmar), so named for the nearby town of that name. It was only "discovered" to be unique to that region in the late 20th century. But for many years snuff bottle collectors have been referring to a very similar looking type of jade (deep, dark green with near-black inclusions) as Chloromelanite.

I understand that the chemical composition of both is almost identical to regular jadeite. If that is so, the specific gravity should also be almost identical. The slightly higher S.P. reading would be due to higher amounts of trace elements such as chromium within the matrix.

Tom
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« Reply #26 on: July 11, 2016, 02:38:05 am »

Dear Cathy,

I thought this was a Green Serpentine. GIA charges are very reasonable, I think it is worth checking it out.

Cheers,
YT

Dear Cathy,

I have attached a Snuff Bottle presumably in Bowenite/Green Serpentine material sculpted like a bat. This has been tested with Specified Gravity at 2.94.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bowenite
Bowenite is an especially hard serpentine (5.5) of a light to dark apple green colour, often mottled with cloudy white patches and darker veining. Deposits in China are in the SuZhou region, which accounts for it's also being known as SuZhou Jade.

I still think it is a nice idea to check with GIA.

Cheers,
YT


* 124b.jpg (70.39 KB, 550x654 - viewed 13 times.)
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« Reply #27 on: July 11, 2016, 04:35:54 pm »

Dear Cathy,

    As the starter of the thread, you can change the title of the thread.
It is patently NOT 'Emerald Green Jade'.
Please do me a favour and change it to "Green Stone Bottle. Jade?"
Thank you,
Best,
Joey
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Joey Silver, collecting snuff bottles since Feb.1970

cshapiro
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« Reply #28 on: July 11, 2016, 05:38:07 pm »

YT - that is a beautiful bottle!

Joey - I did not realize I could change the title - so just did.

Wink
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« Reply #29 on: July 11, 2016, 07:10:32 pm »

Dear Cathy,

      Thank you. It took me almost a year till I discovered it. So you are faster than me!  Grin

And yes, YT's Spinach Green Jade Bat bottle is a real beauty.
I think it is ca.1780-1830 and possibly Imperial Palace Workshops.

Best,
Joey

YT - that is a beautiful bottle!

Joey - I did not realize I could change the title - so just did.

Wink
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Joey Silver, collecting snuff bottles since Feb.1970

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« Reply #30 on: July 11, 2016, 09:01:36 pm »


YT's Spinach Green Jade Bat bottle is a real beauty.
I think it is ca.1780-1830 and possibly Imperial Palace Workshops.


Dear Joey,

I thought YT was saying in his post that the illustrated green bat bottle is bowenite, not jade.

Best,
Tom
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« Reply #31 on: July 12, 2016, 12:05:03 am »

Dear Cathy,

Thank you.

Dear Joey,

Thank you for the description. I presume this bottle to be Bowenite as the feel is different from my other Spinach Jade. Feels slightly smoother and shows slight translucency.
Will show you when you are here  Wink

Cheers,
YT
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« Reply #32 on: July 12, 2016, 06:54:44 am »

Dear Tom,

     Me bad!  Cheesy Roll Eyes   You are 100% correct.

   I was looking at the picture and not reading the words, and seemed to remember a Spinach Green Jade
Bat bottle, and put two and two together and got five!  Wink

Still, a superb bottle. Thank you YT. I look forward to holding it.

Best,
Joey


YT's Spinach Green Jade Bat bottle is a real beauty.
I think it is ca.1780-1830 and possibly Imperial Palace Workshops.


Dear Joey,

I thought YT was saying in his post that the illustrated green bat bottle is bowenite, not jade.

Best,
Tom
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Joey Silver, collecting snuff bottles since Feb.1970

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« Reply #33 on: July 12, 2016, 07:32:17 am »

Dear YT,

Please excuse me for doubting you, I only want to learn.

You said you presumed you nice snuff was in Bowenite/Green Serpentine and it had an SG of 2.94.

Can you please explain why you think it is not Nephrite, because it looks right for Nephrite to my uneducated eyes.

Unfortunately I am away in the next hour and wont be back for about a week, so please excuse my lack of response to any reply you may give.

Kind regards,

Paul
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« Reply #34 on: July 12, 2016, 08:58:16 pm »

Dear Paul, YT, Tom, et al,

    I also thought it was nephrite jade, spinach green to be precise, from the photo.
I'm not really familiar with 'Bowenite', to be totally honest. Embarrassed
Best,
Joey

 


Dear YT,

Please excuse me for doubting you, I only want to learn.

You said you presumed you nice snuff was in Bowenite/Green Serpentine and it had an SG of 2.94.

Can you please explain why you think it is not Nephrite, because it looks right for Nephrite to my uneducated eyes.

Unfortunately I am away in the next hour and wont be back for about a week, so please excuse my lack of response to any reply you may give.

Kind regards,

Paul
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George
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« Reply #35 on: July 12, 2016, 09:08:36 pm »



I'm not really familiar with 'Bowenite', to be totally honest. Embarrassed


 



It is a mineral that they dye quite often.. I see it with a lot of turquoise.. It is not actually turquoise, but dyed bowenite. 
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« Reply #36 on: July 12, 2016, 11:08:41 pm »

Dear Joey and Paul,

I am just assuming it is Bowenite as it does not look like the Spinach Jade that I have. As for the hardness, it is definitely harder than my other serpentine bottles.

Even Christies describe this bottle as Zoisite but the SG is not 3.10-3.36.

Cheers,
YT  Huh
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« Reply #37 on: July 12, 2016, 11:26:22 pm »



Even Christies describe this bottle as Zoisite but the SG is not 3.10-3.36.

Cheers,
YT  Huh

That is pretty bad for Christies to believe this Zoisite !
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« Reply #38 on: July 13, 2016, 04:07:53 am »

I agree - I had a Ruby Zoisite bottle I bought from YF Yang between 1974 and 1977, made from a stone brought back to the PRC by Chinese workers on the Tanzania-Zambia Railroad between 1970 and 1975.
So chances are it was barely finished when I bought it. Grin
Wow! First owner. Not really a thing to be proud of, if you collect antiques. Roll Eyes Grin
Best,
Joey





Even Christies describe this bottle as Zoisite but the SG is not 3.10-3.36.

Cheers,
YT  Huh

That is pretty bad for Christies to believe this Zoisite !
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Joey Silver, collecting snuff bottles since Feb.1970

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« Reply #39 on: July 13, 2016, 07:19:28 am »

I agree - I had a Ruby Zoisite bottle I bought from YF Yang between 1974 and 1977, made from a stone brought back to the PRC by Chinese workers on the Tanzania-Zambia Railroad between 1970 and 1975.
So chances are it was barely finished when I bought it. Grin
Wow! First owner. Not really a thing to be proud of, if you collect antiques. Roll Eyes Grin
Best,
Joey


Unless you are 160, then you can claim to have a 19th Zoisite bought first hand
 Grin
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