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Chinese Snuff Bottle Discussion Forum 中國鼻煙壺討論論壇
June 24, 2018, 07:35:45 am
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Sharing a B&W bottle

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Author Topic: Sharing a B&W bottle  (Read 564 times)
Lamlam
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« on: February 24, 2016, 11:42:11 pm »

I would like to post some pictures for your comments, especially the theme, which I have some vague ideas about but would like to know more.

Thanks all

Curt



* IMG_1252.JPG (96.82 KB, 480x640 - viewed 26 times.)

* IMG_1251.JPG (102.4 KB, 480x640 - viewed 21 times.)

* IMG_1259.JPG (61.56 KB, 640x480 - viewed 13 times.)

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Wattana
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« Reply #1 on: February 26, 2016, 10:36:25 pm »

Hi Curt,

I was hoping someone would be able to respond to your request. Unfortunately, my knowledge in this area is limited. The man looks a little too schoarly for a fisherman, but that appears to be his activity, judging by the tall fish basket next to him and the rod in his hand.
I wait with interest to see if anyone can translate the inscription. 

Tom
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Tom
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Joey
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« Reply #2 on: February 26, 2016, 11:25:15 pm »

Dear Curt,

      I just found this thread, for some reason. I had been used to getting 'notices' into my email, when there was a new thread.

      If you look at my B & W catalogue "In Search of a Dragon", and turn to #50, you will see a representation of the scholar as fisherman.

      The colour of the blue, assuming it is correctly represented on my screen, seems wrong for an old bottle, but I'm not good at judging over the screen.
Best,
Shabbat Shalom,
Joey
     
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Joey Silver, collecting snuff bottles since Feb.1970

Wattana
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« Reply #3 on: February 27, 2016, 05:45:50 am »

Hi Curt,

Forgot to ask earlier....
The base is not very clear in your picture because of the label and other gunge, but appears to be a dragon design in raised slip. Is that correct?

Tom
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Tom
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Joey
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« Reply #4 on: February 27, 2016, 06:28:07 am »

Dear Tom,
 
      I thought I was observant, but you really beat me this time (and not for the first time, either).
I never even notices the dragon, or whatever it is.  Kudos.

 Dear Curt,

      Looking again at the shape, the finish of the foot rim, etc., I would go so far as saying it could be Guangxu (ca.1880-1908), although it could be later, of course.

Best,
Shabbat Shalom,

Joey
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Joey Silver, collecting snuff bottles since Feb.1970

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« Reply #5 on: February 27, 2016, 04:20:56 pm »

Dear Tom,
I don't think that the dragon is raised slip. I think that it is just a misfired under glaze copper red.
Dear Curt, I am with Joey here, not older than Guangxu, but probably later I think.
Kind regards
Giovanni
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« Reply #6 on: February 27, 2016, 05:37:54 pm »

Wonderful bottle Curt .. Smiley
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Lamlam
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« Reply #7 on: February 28, 2016, 06:13:34 am »

Thank you guys.

Giovanni, yes I think the dragon design on the base was just misfired, not raised slip.

I personally like the 5 bats on the shoulder, which we all know alludes to 'Five Fortunes coming to your door'.  The blue color is quite vivid, in my opinion. 

Joey/Giovanni, could you share with me on how to tell the age of a B&W by looking at the blue color please? 

Best, Curt
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« Reply #8 on: February 28, 2016, 05:02:01 pm »

Dear Curt,
I don't judge the age of a bottle by the tonality of the blue. Even among Kangxi porcelain, which are famous for its gorgeous blue, you can find blue of any tonality. I mainly judge according to the shape of the foot and the exposed paste, plus the painting style.
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Giovanni
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« Reply #9 on: February 29, 2016, 05:04:02 am »

Dear Curt,

     Unlike my good friend Giovanni, who is very scientific in his analysis, I'm much more visceral.
When I look at a bottle it seems to speak to me as either antique, old or modern. The colour on the bottle you posted seems to remind me of modern bottles I've seen. I would trust Giovanni's opinion above my own over the 'Net, while I would trust both as a rule, live.

    In this happy instance, our opinions over the 'Net coincided.

    Best,
Joey
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Joey Silver, collecting snuff bottles since Feb.1970

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« Reply #10 on: February 29, 2016, 06:25:36 am »

Dear Joey,
what I said about the blue was indeed a general comment. The tone of the blue is not constant and specific for a period, and besides that we must consider too that it changes a lot according to the settings of the cameras and the colorís rendition accuracy of the monitors.
But I must say that in the case of Curtís bottle, I agree that the blue seems a bit dull and, most important, monotone, lacking shades.
Kind regards
Giovanni
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« Reply #11 on: March 01, 2016, 08:58:55 am »

Dear Giovanni,
 
      I accept everything you wrote to me, but who is Mike, and what was what you wrote to him in reference to? Sounds like an interesting conversation, but one I was not privy to... Roll Eyes
Best,
Joey



Dear Mike,
I have never seen a similar vessel but I have serious doubt about being it Ming. The horse is not in Ming style, the base too, and (just a feeling) the handle too is odd for the Ming period I think. But the main point for being not Ming is the horse.
The luting line is there because it is a close vessel, so it is normal. It would not be there if there was a cover.
Kind regards
Giovanni
Dear Joey,
what I said about the blue was indeed a general comment. The tone of the blue is not constant and specific for a period, and besides that we must consider too that it changes a lot according to the settings of the cameras and the colorís rendition accuracy of the monitors.
But I must say that in the case of Curtís bottle, I agree that the blue seems a bit dull and, most important, monotone, lacking shades.
Kind regards
Giovanni

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Joey Silver, collecting snuff bottles since Feb.1970

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« Reply #12 on: March 01, 2016, 01:51:46 pm »

Dear Joey,
haha, I didn't realize that! For some strange reason I have pasted in that post a comment that I did on Gotheborg. I don't undertand how it happened. Thank you, I did delete the comment.
Kind regards
Giovanni
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« Reply #13 on: March 02, 2016, 01:40:51 am »

Dear Giovanni,

      When next I visit, I hope you can let me read some of the correspondence on Gotheborg.
Best,
Joey
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Joey Silver, collecting snuff bottles since Feb.1970

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