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Chinese Snuff Bottle Discussion Forum 中國鼻煙壺討論論壇
December 18, 2017, 02:20:19 pm
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Crystal Clear

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Question: JrDvL
tNtqvtwjzGv - 0 (0%)
PKUOMFnoSD - 0 (0%)
cLkJkLBQWUPQnEBXDR - 0 (0%)
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Wattana
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« Reply #200 on: March 23, 2016, 09:02:52 pm »

Hi Marcos,

Yes, Joey and George are right, you need very finely ground coffee to replicate the snuff powder.

I don't want you to waste precious coffee, but try filling one almost all the way to the top, and leave the other empty. (That's the advantage of having a double bottle - you can compare empty and full, side by side, at the same time !!)

In practice, when this bottle was a functioning container, the owner would probably have kept a different 'flavour' in each. The crystal being clear, it would have been possible to tell which was which from the difference in tone. Twin bottles in porcelain and other opaque materials needed coloured stoppers to differentiate the contents, unless, of course, the 'twins' were not identical.

Tom

« Last Edit: March 23, 2016, 09:05:06 pm by Wattana » Report Spam   Logged

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« Reply #201 on: March 23, 2016, 09:15:41 pm »

Hi Tom,

I will buy proper snuff powder and fill one of containers to the top.

I will photograph the results to show you guys.

Thanks a lot for the tip.

Warmest Regards,

Marcos
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« Reply #202 on: March 23, 2016, 09:18:02 pm »

Hi Marcos,

Looking forward to the results.
But be warned - snuff powder is a lot more expensive than coffee!  Wink

Tom
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« Reply #203 on: March 24, 2016, 06:27:11 am »

Dear Marcos,

       Tom is right. Buy cheap powdered coffee instead. It will work as well at a tenth of the cost.
Happy Purim,
Best,
Joey



Hi Marcos,

Looking forward to the results.
But be warned - snuff powder is a lot more expensive than coffee!  Wink

Tom
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« Reply #204 on: July 28, 2016, 01:05:29 am »

Here is a recent addition for this thread....

Description
     Rock crystal snuff bottle of rounded rectangular form, evenly hollowed, with a broad slightly concave lip, and a wide rounded oval footrim surrounding a flat recessed base; the body carved in low relief with a continuous winter landscape scene of trees, rocky outcrops and a pavilion in the distance. Lavender blue jade stopper set in a gilt-silver collar, attached to a wavy-stemmed bone spoon.
      
Height w/o stopper: 6.6 cm

Tentative dating: 1760–1860

Commentary
     This bottle belongs to a group of similar examples from an as yet unidentified workshop active in China from around the mid-1700s up to the late 1880s. These bottles share a number of characteristic features, notably that they are almost always carved employing a mix of very low relief and lightly incised lines. The stone most favoured by this workshop is clear colourless natural quartz, occasionally using smoky quartz or citrine. The subject matter is invariably a wintry landscape scene, including one or more leafless trees to indicate the season. The use of icy clear quartz further reinforces this notion. And as with classical landscape painting, there is an economy of line, with areas of the bottle left untouched for the sake of balance and a sense of spaciousness.
     Bottles from this group often appear to use perfectly flawless quartz crystal when in fact that is not always the case. Clever use is made of any natural faults, incorporating them into the overall design. On the bottle seen here there are some wispy opaque threads running through the stone, which have been disguised behind the twisting trunks of the trees in the foreground (see red dash lines in the second photo below).
 
For a discussion of the stopper, see the following thread…
     http://snuffbottle.smfforfree.com/index.php/topic,3108.0.html



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« Last Edit: July 28, 2016, 01:09:46 am by Wattana » Report Spam   Logged

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« Reply #205 on: July 28, 2016, 05:16:29 am »

Dear Tom,

   A wonderful bottle. Congratulations. I had one very similar to this one, which I had bought from Bob Hall LTD., in 1989.
They are very appealing in an understated way. Possibly BECAUSE they are so understated.

   In the same way, low relief white nephrite jade bottles appeal to me.

   I was looking at your dating, and I would suggest a dating of ca.1760-1850. I doubt there was a lot of snuff bottle carving going on during the Taiping Rebellion...

 

Best,
Joey
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« Reply #206 on: July 28, 2016, 05:37:16 am »

Beautiful bottle Tom.. Congratulations !

Interesting about the yet unidentified workshop.. I have not read about this before..

Thanks for sharing !
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« Reply #207 on: July 28, 2016, 05:40:30 am »

Dear Joey and George,

Thanks for your comments.

Yes Joey, those understated jades appeal to me also. It's that "shibui" thing again....!  Wink

Best,
Tom
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« Reply #208 on: July 28, 2016, 09:32:26 am »

Tom,

Another wonderful bottle among the many you have.  I'm going to put you on the spot a bit to educate those of us that have only a little or no experience in collecting such bottles.  Strictly speaking to clear quartz bottles what should be the expected price range one would have to pay to purchase such bottles?  I would like to get your thoughts and experience on the price point of old (such as the one you illustrated) verses such bottles produced later (20th century) and/or new of such quality. 

Charll   
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« Reply #209 on: July 28, 2016, 03:05:55 pm »

I too would like to hear your thoughts.  This bottle is simply elegant!  Great find.   Jo
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« Reply #210 on: July 28, 2016, 04:45:35 pm »

Dear Tom,

Thank you so much for sharing your knowledge on the stone bottles, So much to learn from your post.:)Thank you.

LOVE the bottle as usual.

Steven
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« Reply #211 on: July 28, 2016, 07:40:51 pm »

Tom

Do you think that my crystal bottle in low relief is from the same workshop ? Remember the one with aging  cracks but using some of the natural fault lines ? Thanks in advance 
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« Reply #212 on: July 28, 2016, 08:11:14 pm »


Do you think that my crystal bottle in low relief is from the same workshop ? Remember the one with aging  cracks but using some of the natural fault lines ?
 

Hi Pat,

Definitely! I believe I suggested that at the time I first saw it.

Tom
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« Reply #213 on: July 28, 2016, 08:14:49 pm »

Hmm yes you did ... Age is creeping up on me lol ... Need to find the link and add it here..
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« Reply #214 on: July 28, 2016, 08:26:51 pm »

Found it :

http://snuffbottle.smfforfree.com/index.php/topic,2350.0.html
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« Reply #215 on: July 28, 2016, 08:32:33 pm »

Pat, well done! It's a beauty, despite the cracks.

Charll, Jo and Stephen, thanks for your inputs!

Charll, you have put me in a spot, mainly because I am aware that we decided a while back not to discuss prices on the forum. But since the bottle you are asking about was won at a Bonhams auction in New York a few months ago, the hammer price is public knowledge. Anyway, I'll send you a Personal Message with my responses.

Tom
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« Reply #216 on: July 28, 2016, 08:51:10 pm »

Guys,
     Here is another "Rustic Quartz Master School" bottle. By coincidence, Ted Exstein and his family arrived tonight for the weekend.
Best,
Joey


Christies NYC SALE 1156 - THE BLANCHE B. EXSTEIN COLLECTION OF CHINESE SNUFF BOTTLES
21 March 2002

LOT 144
A FINE CARVED AMETHYST BOTTLE
RUSTIC CRYSTAL MASTER SCHOOL, 1750-1850
 
A FINE CARVED AMETHYST BOTTLE
Rustic Crystal Master School, 1750-1850
Of flattened, rounded-rectangular form, well-carved in relief with a monkey family playing in a pine grove, the reverse with a continuation of a more distant landscape scene, with a pavilion in the foreground, well hollowed, stopper
2 13/16in. (72mm.) high
Provenance: Hugh M. Moss, Ltd., London.
Exhibited: Chinese Snuff Bottles, Taipei Gallery, New York, 1993, p. 11.
 
This unusual pale amethyst bottle is a masterpiece from the Rustic Crystal Master School, with an unusual and very even pale-colored material, delightful subject, and masterly control of the medium. For other examples of the school, see lot 137. This is a typical decorative scheme for the artist, where a high-relief subject on one side is balanced by a low-relief landscape on the other. The monkeys stand for advancement through the ranks.

For another imposing bottle by the Rustic Crystal Master with high relief on one side and low relief on the other, see L. S. Perry, Chinese Snuff Bottles: The Adventures and Studies of a Collector, Rutland, Vermont, 1960, p. 58, no. 30.
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« Reply #217 on: July 29, 2016, 02:13:36 am »

Dear Joey,

That is an outstanding bottle. And from the good old days when the buyer's premium was "only" 22%.

Best,
Tom


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« Reply #218 on: July 29, 2016, 04:45:05 am »

Dear Tom,

     I remember the really 'Good Old Days', when the commission PLUS tax was 10% !  Grin
Best,
Joey
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« Reply #219 on: July 29, 2016, 04:54:43 am »

Dear Tom,

Yours is a nice example of a crystal. Does this group all come in a certain size and height?

I have an amethyst very well hollowed and has inclusions on it's base and on one of the side. Is it also from this group?  7cm height

Cheers,
YT

Just saw Joey's response. The recent Paris auction had a very reasonable commission.  Wink


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