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This Chinese snuff bottle community forum is dedicated to the novice, more experienced, and expert collectors. Topics are intended to cover all aspects and types of bottle collecting. To include trials, tribulations, identifying, researching, and much more.

We also freely pour out our pains of spending money, only to later find that our choice in a bottle was not as we expected ! There is no extra charge for our "pain management" program !

We are also working extra hard towards supporting, and giving well deserved recognition to all new and upcoming student artists of "Very Modern" inside painted bottles.

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Among other things, donations help keep the forum free from Google type advertisements, and also make it possible to purchases additional photo hosting MB space.

Forum Bottle In The Spotlight !

Another extra special bottle that our fellow collector Pin shared. The "thousand word" classical text is painted by LI Ruchen with a beautifully shaped bottle of upright rectangular form, and sloping shoulders. Congratulations Pin !

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Contemporary Schools Of Inside Painting, by Peter Bentley

Part One (pdf)
Part Two (pdf)

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Reign Marks on Qing Ceramics 1644-1912

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Gotheborg's Marks On Chinese Porcelain

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Snuff Bottle Collector
The web site Snuff Bottle Collector is a labor of love as an expression of gratitude to and admiration for a group of artists and craftsmen whose concentrated, patient works deserve a world audience.

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The International Chinese Snuff Bottle Society


Chinese Snuff Bottle Discussion Forum 中國鼻煙壺討論論壇
June 24, 2017, 07:13:14 am
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1  The Gathering / The Lounge / Re: Booted by the ICSBS on: June 22, 2017, 10:17:42 pm
Thanks Joey. 

I will have a look which one I am missing.   If I could be assured this doesn't happen again, I would rejoin, because I like the journals... and one day will join a event.   I forgot to mention, I did interact with Virginia, and then got radio silence, maybe because she left... not sure.

At the time I was using my IBM office address, and had almost perfect scorecard in receiving items, as there was always someone to 'receive' or 'sign for'.

Appreciate your help as always. 
2  The Gathering / The Lounge / Re: Booted by the ICSBS on: June 22, 2017, 08:25:15 pm
Joey

Yes, I mis-wrote, you are right.   But since I never even got a complete year's worth of journals, I kind of remembered the old rhythm... I paid up dues for 2015, I recall. 
3  The Gathering / The Lounge / Re: Booted by the ICSBS on: June 22, 2017, 02:02:39 am
Cathy

I have a LOT of duplicate journals that I have accumulated over the years.  Let me have a look what I have.  Maybe we can do an exchange for something.. like the Chen Zhongsan we discussed a while ago.  If you still have it please keep it for a possible exchange.  Many of what I have double you would have a rough time finding in the market, I think.  I bought 4-5 large collections to get where I am today.
4  The Gathering / The Lounge / Re: Booted by the ICSBS on: June 22, 2017, 01:21:40 am
Cathy

That's strange, but if it makes you feel any better, I was a member for a year, only received only 1 of the periodicals, and after repeated requests (almost pleading or begging) was ever sent 1 of the 2 missing ones, had my further requests completely ignored, and then NEVER received a subscription renewal . Needless to say, I was significantly less than impressed. 

And I am not exactly a beginner collector, I have been at this since 1999, and avoided membership forever because of the elitist attitude until Joey joined here, and then gave it a shot, with the results above.   

This in a public forum, so I hope someone at ICSBS is reading this.  Customer service needs to be DRAMATICALLY improved.
5  Public Forum Categories and Boards / Porcelain and Yixing Chinese Snuff Bottles 瓷器和宜兴鼻烟壶 / Re: Same Artist? on: June 21, 2017, 10:32:42 pm
Well, at first glance yes, but then I realized it is actually an easy scene to replicate, so I am not sure.  This is a later copy in my view.
6  The Gathering / The Lounge / Re: Guess Who is He on: June 20, 2017, 10:27:10 pm
Wow.... any idea of the cost of these?   Thank for sharing Pin!
7  Public Forum Categories and Boards / Gem, Stone, Rock and Fossil / Re: Batman and Robin on: June 19, 2017, 10:43:33 pm
Thanks Cathy ! 

By the way, although my 'love' is MPIP, I am one of the people here who doesn't care so much about the age or utility of a bottle, and can and do appreciate younger, newer, beautiful and artful bottles.  Some of us here are similar in that respect, and then we have the more 'purist' collectors, who prefer the original 'made for snuffing', old, provenance etc... . which is also fine, just a different slant based on the beauty and variety of snuff bottles, whether new, young, or old, or antique...

Don't get discouraged, or take things too personal.   You have come a long way in the short time you are collecting!  You have acquired some bottles that I and others really admire (and covet. haha). But if we all liked the same things, the world would be a boring place, right?
8  Public Forum Categories and Boards / Gem, Stone, Rock and Fossil / Re: My Third Attempt... on: June 19, 2017, 06:22:06 pm
Hi Jo

It's a beautiful bottle and love the color but my'gut' first reaction tells me it is new ...and we all know that gut reactions are often as wrong as they are right ...
9  The Gathering / Introductions / Re: A Recently Discovered Obsession... on: June 19, 2017, 06:16:08 pm
Daniel

Welcome to the forum ! I am a Bangkok based collector but have been in Asia since 1999. You are doing the right thing by investing in a ton of reference material. Happy hunting ! Look forward to see some of your bottles .
10  Public Forum Categories and Boards / Inside Painted Chinese Snuff Bottles / Early, Middle and Modern Period Bottles 内画鼻烟壶/早期,中期,现代 / Re: Teasing the Crane in the Tang Collection? on: June 19, 2017, 06:11:21 pm
Hi Steven

Ok lol. Thanks ! I can accept that but that's not what multiple other sources said. Let's just see what come back from Joey's inquiry about the Xue family. I want to put this debate to rest finally. Especially since there are 40 or more bottles (between both artists ) deserving to get categorized correctly. And as Beijing artists instead of Shandong artists. We keep learning more as we debate and sometimes disagree. Thanks for reviving the discussion!

All the best !
11  Public Forum Categories and Boards / Gem, Stone, Rock and Fossil / Re: Batman and Robin on: June 19, 2017, 05:10:11 am
Here is one of my 'monkey face' bat bottles in rock crystal.  Silver spoon, 6cm tall. 
12  Public Forum Categories and Boards / Inside Painted Chinese Snuff Bottles / Early, Middle and Modern Period Bottles 内画鼻烟壶/早期,中期,现代 / Re: Teasing the Crane in the Tang Collection? on: June 18, 2017, 11:45:31 pm
Yes Steven , like I said, unlikely, but not impossible and surely remarkable.   And makes those bottles even more special, in my view.   I would have a hard time placing my 1922 bottle in 1982 though.   Would you agree?   

For reference from Crane Collection, Ye Bengqi working period:

Born 1908, died in 1975, worked from 1924-1960 (36 year career, not 50)

http://www.thecranecollection.com/the-collection/inside-painted/modern-school/?tx_ttproducts_pi1%5BbackPID%5D=59&tx_ttproducts_pi1%5Bproduct%5D=140&cHash=73f735c023

Update:

Whoever has Snuff Bottle Review, Vol 5, No. 3 September 1980:

Quote (author, name to be uncovered in earlier mags, accompanied by YF 'Happy' Yang, yes THE Y.F. Yang):  One painter recently retired at age 87, Xue Xi Xiang. It is interesting to note that he has the same surname as Xue Shaofu and his son Xue Chengcai. who are very well known Peking artists.
This the first ever confirmation that these guys are Beijing artists!  I always thought that overlay MPIP bottles were exclusive to Shandong, which seems now wrong.

Also, please note the link between the 1900 Boxer uprising and the cultural revolution:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Lanterns_(Boxer_Uprising)

More detail about the Boxer uprising:

https://www.facinghistory.org/nanjing-atrocities/nation-building/rebels-boxer-rebellion

Dear Joey

I would be very grateful if you could ask Y.F. Yang what he remembers about Xue Shaofu and Xue Chengcai in any details, to clear this up once and for all, for all of us.   Thanks!
13  Public Forum Categories and Boards / Inside Painted Chinese Snuff Bottles / Early, Middle and Modern Period Bottles 内画鼻烟壶/早期,中期,现代 / Re: Teasing the Crane in the Tang Collection? on: June 18, 2017, 11:29:46 pm
Hi Steven

The earliest known overlay Xue Shaofu that I am aware of is 1898, this would not make it possible for the father to have a 60+ year painting career, but I do agree that the life span of the two artists can make it long and drawn out.  Another argument in this is that my earliest dated Xue Chengcai bottle is dated 1922, so this would also mean a 50+ year career for him. While not impossible (and only if there are no other Xue Chengcai bottles say from 190x), this is really all a bit unlikely, but not impossible. 

We may never really know how this all plays out.  But it remains really interesting and funny that we are revisiting a 5 year old discussion.   The most intriguing (to me, anyway), is that Joey's bottle is really painted 'old style, ie.  MPIP style), and mine from 1922 (or 1982?) is also.... 

The Shandong school as a whole had moved on way beyond that style by then... while for Xue Chengcai time stood still?  All a bit weird too no ?
14  Public Forum Categories and Boards / Inside Painted Chinese Snuff Bottles / Early, Middle and Modern Period Bottles 内画鼻烟壶/早期,中期,现代 / Re: Teasing the Crane in the Tang Collection? on: June 18, 2017, 08:34:38 pm
Steven et al,

Repeating my earlier question.  Is there any new reason or clue to doubt that Xue Shaofu and Xue Chengcai are father and son, given this quite extensive spread in time between the two?   This is of course assuming that 1938 (last date of Xue Shaofu) and the bottle posted by Steven from Xue Chengcai, from mid to late 60s, i.e. a 30 year spread.

By the way, after checking my collection, I DO have dated bottles by Xue Shaofu, the earliest dated one is 1905, and the latest dated one is 1928.

To further confuse matters look at the thread below, which has a 1972 (1912?) bottle from Xue Chengcai, and a 1922 in my collection (1982?, doubt it..):

http://snuffbottle.smfforfree.com/index.php/topic,813.20.html

Steven,

Just to be the devil's advocate, on the bottle you posted, the lantern can indeed be a train station lantern, and the clothes they are wearing are too colorful to be from the cultural revolution where they were either dressed all-green with red patches/armbands, or in any case generally quite drab.  This could be clothing from the early republic era.. Just to fuel the discussion  .. 5 years hence.  LOL.   SMILE

It makes our argument from years ago make sense.  They actually may have painted simultaneously, as in a family studio.

15  The Gathering / The Lounge / Re: HK Members Gathering - June 2017 on: June 18, 2017, 06:35:44 am
Cool pic guys !

Peter

Even though you are technically in your golden years , last I remember you didn't have blond (ish) hair. Is it the picture or is this a coloring ? Lol  Huh Grin
16  Public Forum Categories and Boards / Inside Painted Chinese Snuff Bottles / Early, Middle and Modern Period Bottles 内画鼻烟壶/早期,中期,现代 / Re: Teasing the Crane in the Tang Collection? on: June 18, 2017, 03:44:18 am
Hi Steven

That argument we had was so long ago I almost forgot. And now it seems I have to reclassify some of my bottle into modern... water under the bridge haha ..No apologies needed. Are we still sure that Xue Chengcai is Xue Shao Fu's son? I was told the father stopped painting in 1938 or died in 1938?

Incidentally, I own about 30 or so Xue Shaofu bottles and i don't believe there is one which is dated.
17  Public Forum Categories and Boards / Inside Painted Chinese Snuff Bottles / Early, Middle and Modern Period Bottles 内画鼻烟壶/早期,中期,现代 / Re: Teasing the Crane in the Tang Collection? on: June 14, 2017, 09:16:47 pm
Wow.  Congrats Cathy!   

And one shocking thing is that this dispels the notion that Ding (and perhaps Zhou Le Yuan too) never repeated subjects.   
18  Public Forum Categories and Boards / Inside Painted Chinese Snuff Bottles / Early, Middle and Modern Period Bottles 内画鼻烟壶/早期,中期,现代 / Re: Need Help with the Artist on: June 14, 2017, 12:42:52 am
Cathy

Thanks for posting this one... this may indeed be the missing link to many of the other warrior bottles that just didn't look like YST.  Great....

Someone in China once told me that Liu Qiao continued painting until right before WWII (say probably until mid 30s given the Japanese occupation of China).  This could explain so many other warrior bottles that are clearly NOT YST.
19  Public Forum Categories and Boards / Inside Painted Chinese Snuff Bottles / Early, Middle and Modern Period Bottles 内画鼻烟壶/早期,中期,现代 / Re: Need Help with the Artist on: June 13, 2017, 11:31:50 pm
I am not 100pct sure but I don't think I have ever seen a warrior bottle signed Liu Qiao. This could explain a lot about the unsigned warrior bottles that are not in the typical colors/hues of Yong Shou Tian.
20  Miscellaneous / Snuff Bottle Books, CD, DVD, Videos / Re: SNUFF BOTTLE REVIEW~Lot Of 22 Issues~1975-1983 on: May 31, 2017, 11:45:37 pm
Thanks George!
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