Chinese Snuff Bottle Discussion Forum 中國鼻煙壺討論論壇

Sharing a recent addition to my collection.

This lime green colour is not a common one and the shape, almost a flattened spade shape, is not common in octagonal bottles either but, to me, very appealing. 54mm high and showing signs of wear. 1750-1860 ?

The flattened bottle shape seems to be thought of as mid Qianlong onwards which is also around when this colour was thought to date from with early examples carved from solid blocks of glass while this one has been blown and then handed to a lapidary for final shaping and polishing.

Regards, Adrian.

Dear Adrian, you have a special eye for catching glass bottles, congratulations!
Very nice bottle.
While I can't date it, I must say that the more time passes and the more I am believing that glass bottles carved from a solid block is a tale.
Well, I have exaggerated a bit; I can't say that they do not exist, but for sure to me they are much much rarer than what is commonly believed.
Kind regards. Nice bottle!
Giovanni

Dear Giovanni,

I would say you are right in that bottles carved from solid blocks of glass are somewhat rare.

When I have time I will look through the Treasury books and see if I can find any examples for you.

I still maintain that my "The colour of snow you mustn't eat bottle" is carved and if I ever sign myself up for a glassblowing course I will take it along with me to check if I am right.

Regards, Adrian.

Adrian,
Nice bottle! I like the color. Dumb question, but does spade shape refer to a taper along a bottle’s edge? I always thought it meant a taper from top to bottom along faces, like a shield shape?
Cheers,
Rube

Adrian,

Very nice bottle, I like the unique colour. You have quite a few of these glass bottles in your collection that I've seen you upload (if I'm not mistaken), where do you come across such a selection? I have a very hard time finding bottles let alone these octagonal ones from the Qianlong period! I am lime green with envy  :P

~Daniel

Hi Rube,

I would say a spade shape seems to me to narrow towards the base looking face on but they tend to narrow towards the base when looking side on as well. Spade shaped may not have been the most accurate description I could have given but my picture doesn't really show how it narrows towards the base from a side view!

Regards, Adrian.

Hi Brian,

Glass bottles are a favourite of mine, probably because I think I can recognise good ones easier than I can in other materials.

I could tell you where I find them but I would have to kill you straight after  ;D

Regards, Adrian.

Adrian,

I agree the color appears to be of an older vintage to me as well.  I also agree that the bottle was blown, for the throat of the bottle appears to have been drilled.  This would have been needed when bottle after shaping was separated from the rod, for the top of the bottle I suspect was attached to a blow pipe.  Given this method, I would also suspect that the bottle was blown into a mold, then handed off for finishing.  It sure appears (as can be judged here from the photos) to be an older, high quality, bottle as well.

Given the amount of observed bubbles in the glass with is what makes me think it was blown into a mold.  High quality glass cakes or blocks tend to have little to no bubbles. That is what made them so attractive for use in imitating other stones.  Also, if your bottle saw much carving work after the general shaping, the finisher would have needed to go to great effort not to leave any bubble 'pocks' along the surface of the finished bottle.

Maybe I'm over thinking this, but I been asking some of the same questions as to glass bottles and their development.

Charll   

 

Dear Adrian,

   First, a beautiful bottle, and I'd agree as to its dating.

However, it is DEFINITELY NOT a spade-shaped bottle. It must look spade-shaped from the frontal view,to be spade-shaped.
   To describe the  side view correctly, say its width narrows from the neck or shoulder towards the base.
Best,
Joey

What an amazing shape! I love it.

Congrats Adrian, very nice bottle ;D Never seen that shade of green on a new one.. I’ve got a new bottle coming - nothing special but I’ll post it here when it arrives. Was bidding on the recent bonhams auctions but got outbid on the 3 bottles I was interested in. Kind of glad I lost as with customs and shipping it would have got very expensive. Perhaps best to wait for London auctions..

Hi Luke,

Thanks to you, and all the others, for the comments. Looking forward to seeing your bottle as it has been a bit quieter on here recently.

I was registered for yesterdays Doyle's auction but forgot when it started because of the time difference and being busy but wasn't to concerned when I saw the prices realised as I wouldn't have won any lots.

I bought 3 lots from ebay from Richard Woods Fine Arts in the US and now find they won't combine postage costs so 5 snuff bottles are costing $150 to ship to me plus a £8.50 customs handling charge (possibly £25.50 if they come in 3 packages) and 20% import duty. The price I paid for the bottles has far more than doubled when all costs are included  :'(

Regards, Adrian.

Adrian,
Is Richard Woods out of Texas?
Luke,
The same thing happened to me but came out with a few.
Cheers,
Rube

Hi Rube,

Yes, from Texas.

Regards, Adrian.

Hi Adrian,

darn, that sounds rather mean of then. Most sellers I’ve asked for combined postage it’s usally not a problem. Yeah, I’ve noticed or maybe it’s just perceptions that a lot of stunning SBs go in the American auctions and not so much in the UK - annoying though with the extra costs’

I’ll certainly post that bottle when it arrives. I’d appreciate some advice on this one :)

Hey Rube,

Which ones did you buy? Or will you post them at a future date?

I wanted this, but was quickly outbid as the estimate was low imo:
http://www.bonhams.com/auctions/24819/lot/8023/

And a blue and white which went too high for what I thought it was worth, but kind of regretting now. Always another auction and always another bottle  ;D

Best
Luke

Hi Adrian,
that is not tolerable. What you bought are very small items, not fridges. The seller can’t refuse to combine postage; it is your right to not pay him and let him to keep his bottles.
That is absurd. I am convinced that ebay will be on your side if you will refuse to pay.
Kind regards
Giovanni

Adrian,

Have you ever bought from them before?  Or followed any of their auctions?

Luke,

I did not buy that beautiful jade, but I know WHO did!!!

Cheers,

Rube.

Hi Rube,
I can guess who....!   ;)

Adrian,
I agree with Giovanni. It is unreasonable for the vendor not to offer combined postage. You would be within your rights to pull out of the deal.

Best,
Tom

Guys, I did NOT buy that Jade! [Sounds like a certain US Prez, "I did NOT have sex with that woman!" But I REALLY didn't...  ::)  ;D]

 Though I wish I could have. A friend from the Forum was bidding, and although I already have 2, rated '8 / 3*' and '9 / 3*' [by Clare & Michael Chu, a month ago],
I'd have loved to get it.

Best,
Joey

Ok.... I own up.... it’s me... :D

Pin

Congratulations. It’s beautiful!

Congrats Pin! Stunning bottle  ;D

Dear Pin,

    A great example. Congratulations.
So I had 2 friends from the Forum bidding on it.
Best,
Joey

Thanks

Pin

Update on my shipping charges with Richard Woods Fine Arts.

I have been refunded $100 of the shipping charges so instead of being charged $50 for each lot I am being charged for just one package. It happened at the same time they dispatched the package so they clearly managed to get all 5 bottles, sold as 3 lots, in one smaller package. I had sent a message with my payment saying I couldn't believe they were charging so much for such small items and that they didn't combine postage.

While I could delete my initial post about this I thought it would be better to leave it as is.

Pin, lovely bottle.

Regards, Adrian.

Adrian,
As Shakespeare once said, "All's well that ends well."

Hi Pin,
Congratulations! Superb bottle.

Best,
Tom

Dear Tom,

    That's amazing! We have a saying in Hebrew, "Sof tov, hakol tov." It translates as,
"End good, all good".  I wonder when Shakespeare had time to learn Hebrew?  ::) ;D

    Of course, the Arabs say that his real name was not Shakespeare, but "Sheikh Zbir", and that the English stole his material and anglicised his name.

   They also claim that the Brits stole Big Ben from Jerusalem's Jaffa Gate to put in London! Their proof - The big German clock, its face a meter sq., which stood on Jaffa Gate from 1903, in honour of Abd alHamid II was removed by the British, in 1922.
Best,
Joey

Adrian,

The bottle you posted is really beautiful. Well faceted to me and the color is just the right tone.

Inn Bok

Hi Adrian,

I realize that I omitted to comment on your 'lime cordial' green bottle.

Glass bottles don't hold much appeal for me. But I have to admit that the colour is quite unusual, and the way it tapers slightly in side profile is very elegant.

Tom

Adrian,

I truly feel your pain. The shipping cost + customs cost (this crap that Ebay forces you to pay for when most of the time sent standard mail you NEVER have to pay and I'm certain Ebay pockets) and in my case + USDtoCAD (or even worse GBPtoCAD  :-X ) = definitely a killer of the excitement of finding a nice bottle for cheap. Then if you buy online at an auction house throw 20-40% buyers premium on that your $100 treasure turns into a $1000 headache. Lets just hope they wrap them perfectly and customs doesn't rip them open and break your ivory spoons  >:( (true story).

~Daniel

Dear Daniel,
 
     Mark on the declaration, 'bone spoons', and it should get through. Or get the new bamboo spoons, which have no aggro.
Best,
Joey

Joey,

Unfortunately, I wasn't writing the declaration but now I tell all the sellers I buy from "PLEASE write 'bottle' or 'antique bottle' on the customs declaration" as I think "SNUFF bottle" triggers some investigation (it is related to tobacco after all) and ever since I started that all my bottles have arrived undisturbed. A little superglue fixed up my spoons nicely though as it was a clean break. Just an annoyance.

~Daniel

Count your blessings, Daniel.
One of the Forum members bought an extremely expensive [100K euros!] SB in France, and anything over 50K euros [sorry, 60K was a typo] needs an export licence, which can take up to 3 months.
It got dropped and smashed, and took him months to get his money back.
Have them write "small empty gift bottle". It also works.
Best,
Joey

Daniel,

You and Joey are both right - the description on the declaration form should emphasize the key words 'small/miniature bottle', 'empty', and 'gift'.

Avoid using the words 'snuff' and 'antique'....!

Unfortunately, this doesn't work if the auction house handles the shipping. They are obliged to declare the total value, including hammer price, buyer's premium, shipping AND insurance. Consequently, you can get hit with a hefty import duty, as customs base it on this TOTAL figure.

Whenever possible use an independent shipper who can comply with your requests to revise the description.

Best,
Tom

Joey,

Definitely counting my blessings after hearing that story! What a shame. Spoons are replaceable.. 100k bottles are not.. that makes my heart ache!

Tom,

The reason I include 'antique' is because a lot of countries don't put import duties antique items (Canada included) or they have their own duty laws regarding antiques. In Canada though, importing antique items are duty free as their trade do not pose competition to the Canadian economy. Yes, I am very reluctant to import from auction houses because of all the hidden fees, you probably could have found a similar item from a local dealer for the same price after adding it all up! I wish we had more local antique auctions in Vancouver. So far only one decent one but all these Asian antiques are mostly modern knock-offs, rarely any snuff bottles, let alone genuine/old/good condition ones  :-\.

~Daniel