Chinese Snuff Bottle Discussion Forum 中國鼻煙壺討論論壇

Public Forum Categories and Boards => Porcelain and Yixing Chinese Snuff Bottles 瓷器和宜兴鼻烟壶 => Topic started by: forestman on January 31, 2018, 10:04:58 am



Title: Cicada snuff bottle.
Post by: forestman on January 31, 2018, 10:04:58 am
This just arrived from the auction packers as a means of satisfying my need for snuff bottles in what has been a very lean period with a few interesting bottles achieving high prices that I'm too mean to pay.

Porcelain is not an area I collect in so any help with this would be appreciated.

Came minus a stopper and is 8cms which could be life sized for an Empress Cicada. Shows signs of being handled and has snuff remains inside.


Title: Re: Cicada snuff bottle.
Post by: Rube on January 31, 2018, 10:33:16 am
Adrian,
I don’t know anything about porcelain either,
But I love the detail on the underside!
Cheers,
Rube


Title: Re: Cicada snuff bottle.
Post by: Tom B. on January 31, 2018, 03:21:01 pm
Dear Adrian,

I haven't seen another example exactly like yours, so I can't be sure about the date of your molded porcelain Cicada snuff bottle. In my opinion it would be a 19th century example.  Porcelain snuff bottles were not made in any quantity until the late Qianlong period and molded figure examples are all considered to be after 1790.   The following links show a few examples of porcelain cicada snuff bottles:

http://www.christies.com/lotfinder/lot/an-enameled-molded-porcelain-cicada-form-snuff-bottle-5046812-details.aspx?from=searchresults&intObjectID=5046812&sid=83198e8f-1d6c-4971-bf5d-161dffa6f130 (http://www.christies.com/lotfinder/lot/an-enameled-molded-porcelain-cicada-form-snuff-bottle-5046812-details.aspx?from=searchresults&intObjectID=5046812&sid=83198e8f-1d6c-4971-bf5d-161dffa6f130)


https://www.liveauctioneers.com/item/53949703_1819th-c-chinese-qing-dynasty-porcelain-snuff-bottle (https://www.liveauctioneers.com/item/53949703_1819th-c-chinese-qing-dynasty-porcelain-snuff-bottle)


And the one from the Bloch collection has more realistic modeled underside:
A 'famille-rose' enamel on porcelain 'cicada' snuff bottle  Jingdezhen, 1790–1850  6.52 cm high.

http://www.bonhams.com/auctions/20309/lot/139/ (http://www.bonhams.com/auctions/20309/lot/139/)


Yours looks as though it was excavated after a long burial, I would wait for advice from Giovanni before cleaning.  I have seen him work magic on some awful looking ceramics, so he can probably help you to make this better looking too.

Best regards,

Tom B.


Title: Re: Cicada snuff bottle.
Post by: Fiveroosters aka clayandbrush on January 31, 2018, 04:20:16 pm
Thank you dear Tom, but I believe that you are referring to the cleaning of the cracks, which is not the case here.
Dear Adrian, nice bottle, I concur with Tom’s dating. As you see the red color has been faded away on the raised parts, typical sign of long handling, being the red iron enamel more prone to wear then other more glassy enamels.
I would first try to just wash it with dish soap and a tooth bush. Most of the dirty should go away, let see what happens.
Do not be afraid of damaging it; in any case, do not use bleach.
Kind regards
Giovanni


Title: Re: Cicada snuff bottle.
Post by: forestman on February 12, 2018, 08:01:38 am
Dear Tom B and Giovanni,

Sorry for the delay in replying but I had hoped to have time to give this a clean soon after first posting it but have been busy.

Despite several hours of being left in hotter than warm soapy water it has not been easy to remove the dirt which must have been the result of it being buried as the interior was full of earth (and some snuff). I had to chip away very carefully at the dirt with the use of watch makers magnifying glasses. It still could come cleaner but I'm worried about damaging it as the dirt is very reluctant to come off.

Regards, Adrian.


Title: Re: Cicada snuff bottle.
Post by: Tom B. on February 12, 2018, 08:18:36 am
Dear Adrian,

Yes it does look 100% better than before.  I think you could try an Ultrasonic Cleaner.  Giovanni will probably remember that some of the members of the Gotheborg forum used them to clean the encrusted surface of ancient bronze artifacts with amazing results.

Best regards,

Tom B.


Title: Re: Cicada snuff bottle.
Post by: Joey Silver / Si Zhouyi 義周司 on February 13, 2018, 01:55:59 pm
Dear Tom B.,

      Where does one find an ultrasonic cleaner? Is it like the 'yoke' [anything one doesn't know the name of, is called a 'yoke' in rural Irish speech] used for cleaning diamonds?
Best,
Joey


Title: Re: Cicada snuff bottle.
Post by: Rube on February 13, 2018, 02:22:37 pm
Anybody ever use an ultrasonic toothbrush?
Cheers,
Rube


Title: Re: Cicada snuff bottle.
Post by: forestman on February 14, 2018, 11:42:02 am
Dear Joey,

There are plenty on ebay in various sizes and can be bought quite cheaply. They are good for cleaning watches and jewellery (or engine parts if you buy one big enough !).

Regards, Adrian.


Title: Re: Cicada snuff bottle.
Post by: Joey Silver / Si Zhouyi 義周司 on February 14, 2018, 12:32:28 pm
Thanks, Adrian & Rube.
Best,
Joey


Title: Re: Cicada snuff bottle.
Post by: Fiveroosters aka clayandbrush on February 14, 2018, 01:54:23 pm
Dear Adrian,
much better. Do not be afraid to damage the glaze, you can use a blade with no problem, glaze is hard like glass.
Kind regards
Giovanni